Everesting & VEveresting - Discussion, Planning, Training, Tips, Etc

All you notes are 5* but this one is what I was thinking on… Thanks!

I think he means choose a hill that requires a sane number of laps, i.e. not 300! When I’ve used the linked to calculator the hills I see as “doable” need somewhere between 30 & 50 laps to achieve the altitude gain.

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Thanks for creating this tool, it’s been a key part of my planning for both my Everests. Your tips are good as well, I too find low gears a big advantage.

When “if” is discussed are we talking about overall or the uphill sections?

Very good point regarding Intensity Factor (IF). I mean overall for the entire ride, so I suppose you safely can stay somewhat above going uphill. I briefly checked my previous everesting attempts in TrainingPeaks, and it seems I venture close to 0.80 going up. Below is a screen shot from my one of my rides where I ended up with 0.72 for an 8 hour ride (132 km, 6,400 climbing metres, 419 TSS, 5,300 kJ):

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You are thinking of Göran Kropp, there is a wiki in swedish if you are still interested:

Ask Google to translate it for you, I can assist if you want help if Google messes up.

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Regarding IF, did a quick look at my 2 everests:
First one had overall IF of 0.61, with a quick sample of some laps at IFs of 0.64, 0.65, 0.63. I was very consistent on this ride, holding the power quite steady through all the climbs. Ascent 31 (of about 35) was IF 0.63. I ended up riding extra since I felt surprisingly (I was truly surprised how good I felt). This ride ended up being 262 miles and 36,890 feet of climbing, so I think I could have pushed harder and still completed the everest. I had a stretch goal of getting 10km climbing for HRS, which also pushed me towards a conservative pacing.

My 2nd everest had an overall IF of 0.65, with a sampling of ascents at 0.78, 0.72, 0.72, 0.54, 0.58, 0.64, 0.62, 0.69, final ascent 0.64. This one was much harder (at altitude and cold at night), and I also messed up my fueling. The 0.54 was not taking it easy, that was about the same RPE as the 0.7 ascents (the prior one was 0.68). I took a 45 minute break to eat and rest, and slowly recovered, but it wasn’t until daylight and a proper breakfast that I really came back. Bonking alone, at night, in the cold was pretty miserable. I did get 10k meters climbing this time, but I was not going to do more than that - I was very much done.
Looking at this just now, I think that since I was pushing harder on my 2nd attempt, fueling like I did for the first one wasn’t adequate. I didn’t realize how different my pacing was, and didn’t account for this in my fueling.

Another everest in August 2020 is my A event this year. Proper fueling, especially more ‘real food’, will be a key part of my planning for this one.

If you want to look at the data here are the rides on Strava.

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I am thinking about attempting an everesting this year. As i live in the midwest usa, there are not a lot of options for proper climbs. I have scouted this one and i think it is doable, but im not sure it will be valid with the official rules as it runs up and down a fair bit. Anyone here know if this is a valid segment to use?

https://www.strava.com/segments/2657619

It’s fine by my reading of the rules, but not a great hill to use. The first 0.6+ miles is actually the best for a shorter repeat. But that would be lots of reps.

Common recommendation is around 8% average pitch for a reasonable distance / elevation ratio.

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Thanks. This is the segment for the shorter route;
https://www.strava.com/segments/1046414

The everesting calculator says 77.2 reps for the short climb. The longer climb only needs 31.4 reps, because of the accumulated ascending over the entire span and some short uphills on the descent. This was the reason i wasn’t sure it was valid. Is accruing elevation on the descent cheating?

Not cheating AFAIK. The one thing that is not allowed is starting and returning to a high point that allows momentum to be carried into the u-turn.

Not allowed: Start at 500ft elevation going downhill first, ride down to 0ft, climb up to 2000ft, then reverse. The gain down from the 2000ft, thru 0ft, and back up to 500ft is a problem, the way I read the rules.

Allowed: Start at 500ft climb up to 750ft, down to 500ft, and up again to 200f, then reverse. That seems ok since you are u-turning with the next lap pointing up.

Not sure that’s the best way to explain, but I think it’s right.

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That does not look like a good segment to me - too much climbing and rollers on the descent. I would ask about this first before doing it, as much of the ascending on the descent would likely be excluded from the calculation. According to the everesting calculator (everesting.io), this has 669 feet gain on the ascent, and 256 feet of gain on the descent. This seems like way to much gain on the descent to be a good segment to choose. I think using the shorter segment would be much better - it is a bit on the short side, but is much better average gradient wise. It does look very steep at the start - is it really 15%ish?? That is a fair bit on the steep side, both from the climbing and descending perspective.

That said, from comparing these two segments, it seems like the elevation profile is way off at the start of the long segment - the big dip at 0.7 km on the long segment isn’t there on the short one, and the gps track seems off-road on the one with the dip. From my understanding of strava segments, they just take whatever track/elevation profile the person creating it has recorded, and use that, no matter how bad the data is. This can be challenging when trying to use this to determine the ‘actual’ gain on a given climb. When I was planning my Donner Pass everesting, I found multiple segments starting/stopping very close to each other that had a 100 foot (aka 10%) difference in total gain. I always used the more conservative numbers, but that does make the ride longer, possibly unnecessarily.

From the official rules:

If your descent includes a bit of climbing this still counts toward your total. Keep in mind that this is a climbing challenge, and routes with ‘kinetic gain’ should be checked via the everesting calculator first. The calculator has a built-in ‘check’ on descent elevation gain. You’ll know yourself from riding it in real life whether your chosen segment has a gain on the descent. We want to avoid ‘free metres’ where possible. A ‘rule of thumb’ should be applied when looking at a route with elevation gain on a descent or kinetic gain. If it feels like you are gaming the system, then you probably are! Ask us first if in doubt (it’s never nice explaining this afterwards).

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Ok. I sent an email to Hells500 and posted on their strava group, but haven’t gotten a response.

You seem to be right about the grade mismatch. I just ordered a Lezyne super GPS, so i think i will use that to do another scouting of this road and see what it looks like.

There are not a lot of options for an everesting attempt near where i live, so i would like to make it work at this locations one way or another. Its a park road that is always open, low traffic, decent pavement, and parking/visitors center with bathroom at the foot of the climb.

I would do the first part of that climb - it is clearly valid, and will end up being a much shorter ride distance-wise. Doing the first part of a climb is completely valid, and is something that is often done.
My first everesting was this route: Old Foresthill Rd Climb | Strava Ride Segment in Auburn, CA
Someone had already done the first part of that - ie the steeper part, and that would have been an easier segment to do - the last bit of the climb was a lot of work for not much elevation gain.

Sounds like a great place to do this ride - having facilities nearby is important. I’ve been looking for a place to do a ‘suburban’ Everest, and finding a place with toilet facilities has been an issue, as since it’s not out in the wild you can’t just go in the bushes.

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I’m also considering Everesting this year maybe after my first A race or in the end of the season. I have some doubts.
First does it have to be an exact strava segment? I have a 10km climb averaging about 7% but that segment has the first 2km only at 2 to 3% so I’d like to do only the harder 8km and that way get around 8% average but there’s no segment on strava for those exact 8km and I’m not able to create segments with the free version I think.
Second doubt is what cassete to use. I usually use ultegra 11/28 cassete with 36/52 in front. I’m considering buying a new 11-30 or even 11-32 but the 32 says I have to have a long case derraileur so I think I can only use the 11-30. Is this enough todo about 15 or more 8km climbs at an average of 8% with some spots going over 10%?

By the way I’m at 61kg and 1.74cm a bit over 4w/KG ratio at the moment.

I also currently run 11-28 with 52/36. I plan on buying an 11-34 cassette and 105 long cage RD to do my attempt. I am at 3.73w/kg.

Also buying a GPS head unit just for the attempt. I don’t want to fail because i didn’t prepare with low enough gears or invalid data. Better to spend a bit up front than have to do it twice, i think.

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An average 8% climb do you use the 28? Normally in such a climb I don’t need to put the 28 so I was thinking on going as far on a new cassete at 30 or 32 only.

Normally I will only be climbing for a short time and so I smash a higher gear. I did Mt Evans in CO on the 11-28 and had to use the bottom 2 gears only occasionally. I think for this extended effort, having the lower gears is the safer bet.

If you use this everesting calculator to find power/speed you think you can manage.
https://everesting.io/

Then use this gear calculator to find what kind of ratio you will need in order to maintain that power/speed.
https://www.bikecalc.com/gear_ratios

In a 36x32 gear with a cadence of 90 on 25c tires, you will travel at 8mph. If you need to go any slower than that you will need a lower gear or have to use lower cadences.

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What about this?

From reading the rules, no i don’t think it has to be an exact segment, though i’m not sure about this. I do think it needs to be a defined length of road that you repeat completely. I emailed Hells500 and posted on their Strava club page, but haven’t gotten any response.

However, you should be able to create a segment with your free Strava account. just pull up a ride from your activity feed, scroll to the bottom and you should see a “create a new segment” button. This will take you to the segment creation page.

I think it would be a good idea to create the segment even if it isn’t strictly required. It could help with preparation, recording, and submitting.

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