Training plans doesn't contain taper

Looking at the specialty plans none of them are now shown with taper weeks before A-event. I know that the plans now are based on my current levels meaning that I see something different than everybody else, but I would still expect to see some form of taper at the end of the plan. Doing Bird +6 (V02 MAX 9.0, 126 TSS) seems a bit excessive the day before my A event.

If I try to update my current plan I get the taper weeks included as expected, but it would be nice to be able to see the plan layout on the website as well to be able to copy the taper format to other races.

Thought I would ask here to see if this is what everybody now sees before reporting it as a bug to support.

I see a taper week before A events and a rest week after.

It is actually one of the things that stresses me out because I see my CTL drop during those 2 weeks. (I know that’s per the plan, but it still stresses me out because my stupid pride wants to see the highest number at the end of the plan)

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I noticed something similar when looking at the plans directly. I did get a single taper week in my generated plan though (which I’ve increased to a week and a half as that’s how I generally like to do it).

Since you say you see a recovery week after I suspect you are talking about what you see when the plan is added to your calendar (as the plans shown under the training plan section aren’t shown with a recovery week at the end of the plan)?

I have the same as @Textuality where looking at the plans directly no taper weeks are indicated. Funnily enough the plan I’m actually following (Rolling Road Race High Volume) is the only speciality plan that includes an opener, but that workout is placed on the Tuesday and is followed by two hard VO2 max workouts on Thursday and Saturday. All other plans have full workouts on all training days of the week following up to the A event.

Plan builder also asks if you want to include openers

Oh wait, are you saying you want to see them included BEFORE you choose the plan?

If so, the plans change (adapt) as soon as you start them due to AI and your choices.

I don’t necessarily need to have openers at all. I want a proper taper for the A event. In theory the plans shouldn’t change from what is shown when you look directly at a given plan on the website or in the app as they are already shown there based on AI input. This however is only true if you look at it at the start of the speciality phase since you can only look at the full plan when viewing different plans.

I would like the plans to be shown how they actually are intended to be performed. With the second half of the speciality phase stepping down the workload towards the A event and the week(s) leading up to the A event containing a proper taper.

This just isn’t how the software works. If your event is 9 weeks out or 7 weeks out, the plans are going to change around the date of the event, which is how you should want it to work. Use PB to build around your scheduled events and let the program do what it is designed to do. If you don’t like how it looks, take it off your calendar or modify accordingly.

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You seem to be missunderstanding me. The software (plan builder) works exactly as I would like, and expect, it to work.

The separate training plans on the other hand. What is the logic behind showing the plans in a different way than how they are intended to be performed?

This is from the instruction text for Rolling Road Race:

The high-volume version of the RRR Specialty plan will have you on the bike 6 times each week for 1-2 hours during weeks 1-6 and the final 2 weeks are devoted to tapering your training volume while retaining the necessary high intensity in order to leave you fresh but sharp for your most important events.
Weeks 7 and 8 provide a taper format that can be repeated for several weeks of racing, but it’s up to you to decide which week better suits your performance & recovery needs. Typically, B-priority events can follow Week 7’s format while Week 8’s even lower volume lends itself well to A-priority weekends.

Wouldn’t it then be best if the plan shown actually contained a taper? I have a B-priority race this week, but if I copy in week 7 as suggested here I get a 11.9 VO2 max workout at 145 TSS and 0.98 IF the day before the race.

On the other hand, if I try to update my plan after adding a B race to this week I get day off - ramp test - day off for the three days leading up to the race. Neither of theese options seems verry good to me.

Just checking the Low Volume plans on the main site, I see what I’d consider a 2-week taper starting at week 7 and including Week 8 with possible event on Sat or Sun. This is true in the Rolling Road Race, Climbing Road Race and Crit plans that I checked.

What you describe on your actual calendar seems like a bug to me and should certainly be reported.

Yeah. I commented on something similar before my A event. And my comment was that I elected no to do the workout…although I did do another pretty hard VO2 workout that was scheduled earlier in the week. That was for a rolling road race plan, I think? Anyhow, the event was a stage race and I podiumed so how bad can it be?

But, bottom line: keep an open mind but for sure skip that workout if you feel like you should. I’m reminded about Jonathan Vaughters comments about almost destroying the career of a world tour athlete with the extreme workout protocols assigned to the athlete…Vaughters claimed the athlete was largely to blame for actually doing those workouts. His other athletes were smart enough to know not to go that far. :rofl: That’s my advice to you…go into that week knowing that no coach or training software cares about your success as much as you do. If you think you need to skip that workout then skip it. If you think you need openers but something lighter than that, do the openers that make you comfortable. If you feel like doing that workout, do it…but remember this: no training you do on that day is going to induce any adaptation that’s going to help you on race day. Workouts in that time frame are 85% about brain training.

As I have understood it the ramp test that keeps popping up all the time in my calendar is a known bug that support is actively trying to resolve.

Sure, that is a known one under review.

I am talking about the Bird +6 as a day before your event as a new and different issue that should be reported. Two different cases here from what I see.

Then we might talk past each other. The Bird +6 workout doesn’t actually show up on my calendar. But if I go look at the specialty plan on the website, this is my week 8:

If you see taper in the low volume plans on the main site it might seem that we see different things. This is what I see for the final two weeks of low volume criterium:

Yeah, this gets confusing with a mix of info and what you are talking about on your actual plan vs the “default” plans as viewed on the web.

I will just reiterate that I think it’s best that you contact TR support. They can access far more than we can here without you having to share your entire profile and calendar.

We just don’t have enough tools here on the forum.

I actually did a Sunday C race a month a go after doing VO2 on Tuesday and Thursday and Anaerobic on Saturday. Suffice it to say I’m not doing that again.

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I’ve been trying to keep it about the “default” plans all the time, but felt the need to adress my actual plan as people kept replying based on actual plan/calendar.

But in the end it seems I got the feedback that I was looking for, that not everybody has lost all form om taper in the default plans. Which means that it might be a bug for me to report to support.

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I think my plan showed more of a taper, before it adapted around a new FTP with threshold intervals around half the PL’s of previous weeks now it seems to be slightly lower PL’s but shorter sessions and in the last two weeks before the A race endurance sessions are in where there is now Threshold sessions. I may swap the last threshold session (2 days before the A race) for an Endurance one but there seems to me there’s still a taper in there, just not the more obvious halfing of PL’s

I understand what you’re saying about how the default plan appears before you put it on your calendar and start it, but I think you need to take into account that the plan adapts as soon as you select it and begin doing the workouts. What you see in the default WILL NOT be what you end up with. Hopefully support can explain it better than I can and in a way that helps you get what you need. Good luck!

Thread related… any suggestions for VO2max taper sessions? Should I just pick any of them from a lower level? I’m assuming they’ll basically be hard intervals, but with much more generous breaks.

I seem to be OK for threshold / sweet spot sessions.

I’m currently around level 9 on sweet spot, 6 on threshold and 8.5 on vo2max… so I’m thinking no higher than 7 on sweet spot, 4 on threshold and 6 on vo2max. My plan has some taper sessions in for the final week, but they’re very low, and I’ll already have travelled out to where the event is at that point anyway (and I’ll be doing some outdoor cycling for leisure).