I’ve had a Castelli Idro 2 shake dry rain jacket for several years. This was received as a birthday gift about 2 years before it was discontinued for environmental reasons. I was listening to an older episode of The Roadman podcast and they were discussing rain jackets and shake dry. Anthony Walsh (the host) was discussing the PTFE chemicals and said that they were carcinogenic and that anyone who still had a shakedry jacket should stop wearing it and find a way to dispose of it responsibly. I have looked on line and whilst there is clear information about the environmental impact of producing the shakedry material and it’s forever chemicals, is it correct that it could be carcinogenic for the wearer of the jacket? I can’t find any information online that makes that same causal link?
Of course, with what I know now about the environmental concerns I wouldn’t be looking to acquire this jacket now. However, as I already have it, is it an overreaction to stop wearing it on the grounds that it could be carcinogenic?
Apart from the fact that it’s black (which I would avoid for any future rain jacket) it’s in good condition and performs well and from what I read, any replacement rain jacket would likely be a down grade.
Would you continue wearing it or would you be concerned enough about the health risks of the PTFE to buy a new jacket?
Would be grateful for the thoughts of the TR community!
That’s my understanding too - though I know nonstick cookware can become dangerous if it starts to flake off into your food or if you get it hot enough to let off fumes, so I’d guess it’s possible to make a shakedry break down in a harmful way too if you do the wrong things with it. Seems far-fetched to say that a bit of abrasion or some pinholes or whatever would give you issues, and if it really starts coming apart then you’re probably not going to keep using it anyway. So my vote is it’s safe for as long as it’s useful.
I just watched something, veritasium YouTube channel maybe? If I remember right they said there was no evidence that a scratched Teflon pan was causing problems. In theory it should but they aren’t detecting that form of it in blood.
As everyone else has said, it’s environmentally damaging to manufacture and problematic for that reason alone, but once it’s produced PTFE is inert and safe.
I think you’ll get a few opinions but I’d imagine almost nobody really knows the real impact to a person. The way I’d look at it is this - If you’re worried about it then don’t wear it / get rid of it. If you’re not worried about it or are willing to accept risk then you do you. After seeing some of the things I’ve seen and heard at my work I’d probably try to avoid it, but it’s worth mentioning you’re never going to be able to get rid of all environmental hazards.
They are click bait. I don’t trust anything they post on YouTube, and they use several different accounts to post their illogical nonsense.
In the neighborhood that I lived, researchers discovered a dioxin contamination issue that made Love Canal look like a picnic. The guilty party used all kinds of things to attempt to shield themselves from accountability. Around that time, ‘evidence’ started to come out of the internet that sought to whitewash the entire problem. Dioxin is your friend! Ben & Jerry’s ice cream has dioxin in it. Those and hundreds of other lies were pumped over the community. The simpletons ate it up.
Ignoring for a moment that is irrelevant to the discussion if it is in fact true pertaining to the pots/pans, which it seems to be, are you sure this is the channel you are thinking of? He has 2 channels not “several different”.
Like just about every science channel (every channel really), they are always going to get something wrong or skim over something that experts think they should have covered more.
The video in question covered extensively the damages done from pollution related to manufacturing, there was no whitewashing at all in this case.
I mean, this is an area of scientific research. We have a reasonable amount of data on the potential carcinogenicity of things like the PFOA that was in ShakeDry.
They are considered carcinogens. Your largest source of exposure by far is drinking water.
But.
When it comes to toxicology, the dose (and route) make the poison. Much like wearing a jacket made out of hotdogs won’t give you colon cancer just because preserved meat is a carcinogen… wearing a shakedry jacket is not going to give you cancers.
The dose of PFAS required to put you at increased risk of cancer is equivalent to eating an entire non-stick frying pan.
Daily.
Hence my comment about only if you’re eating your jackets.
I see the same guy around YouTube hawking nonsense. And they might not be wrong all the time, but they are not right on some big things. There is a video out there roasting them for some of their videos. I see so many bizarre POS videos that are 1,000% click bait and they freak people out and those people are hooked. These shysters make a really surprising amount of money on their garbage.
Viewer BEWARE!! I’ve run into some garbage from accounts I once trusted higher than they apparently deserved. I can’t tell you what to watch, or not, but I avoid so much content on YouTube. It’s high sewer nozzle potential.
There is a route of exposure. Older PFAS jackets will create more residue that you will breath in over time, and PFAS is CUMULATIVE, not a single dose ‘killer’.
The minimum dose for carcinogenicity is equivalent to eating an entire frying pan. Daily.
You are not getting even within 10 orders of magnitude of that dose by wearing a jacket a few hours a week.
Edit: should be “eating an entire frying pan. weekly.”
A frying pan has about 0.2mcg of available PFOA in it, and the most conservative safe weekly dose of PFOA is 0.35mcg in an average sized adult man. Forgot that PFOA safety levels are based off weekly intake not daily.
If you are going to be off topic this much, at least know who you are talking about. I am not backing or supporting this guy, but the part I mention is in fact backed by science. whether you like the guy or not. But still I’m 99.9% sure you are talking about someone else, this guy has 2 channels, posts 2-3 videos a month and is not all over youtube.
You are clearly passionate about this topic, and understandable. But I think you need to step back for a minute and remove emotion from the discussion.
They are just pointing out the dosage, as that is relevant to the conversation.
People were throwing away pans with scratches because they were told it was killing them. You’d need to keep eating the telfon on an ENTIRE PAN a week at a time to hit the level that is deemed safe, that level is usually just a fraction of what they actually found caused problems in testing.
Since this thread is really about jackets, and people aren’t eating the jackets. The example with the pans just further reinforces how the jacket is not going to be the cause of someone’s health problems because the dose isn’t high enough, and then dose doesn’t even matter because they are not eating it.
If someone ate an entire frying pan worth of PFAS every week, they would still be well below the minimum dose associated with an increased risk of cancer.
Wearing a jacket with PFAS in it a few hours a week is giving you multiple orders of magnitude lower exposer than that.