What zone of Inigo San Millan do you think it is ?
Zone 3, Zone 4 ? And what mmol lactate is Brandon during this 3 times 1h reps do you think ?
1 Like
No idea about lactate and no idea where is his LT1 and LT2. His strava zones are based on 400w FTP and intervals were 3x1h @ 350w so…
i bet they are right at his VT1
1 Like
I’ll put it in here, could go into the Giro thread as well.
Headed down to the French Alps for some riding, a couple of hours time to listen to some podcasts in the car. One German podcast covered the Giro and had interviews with the Bora DS and the coach of JH.
- JH’s one-time all-out power values are fairly mediocre for a pro. Not impressive. However, he is almost unique when it comes to repeatability, the coach hasn’t seen this before. And he was already the coach of Tom Dumolin in 2017.
- JH likes/needs encouragement through the ear piece. Other riders hate it, he likes it. This is why the other DS kept on talking in this one video on the last climb.
- the coach can’t say if JH fatigues less than other riders in a GT. He was actually insisted that this question can’t be anwsered. A GT in the first week is simply different to the last week. For example, first week is far more spikey in power output, when they ride to a climb there are far more power peaks in the first week than in the last week. And these little peaks are quite draining. Therefore, it would be difficult to compare power output on a climb without taking into account how they rode before the climb. However, I may have not understood everything on this point.
8 Likes
Hi !
Can you paste the link of this interview please ?
Thanks !
We saw lots of O/U in MdvP’s training in Feb/Mar this year too. Seems like O/U might be something to notice.
1 Like
Difference between pros and middle-aged wannabes (in this case me):
Caught by a massive shower in the French Alps. Took some shelter. Two pros from B&B, too. They just put on their long finger gloves and buffs, and headed back in the rain.
17 Likes
2 Likes
ha, but I rode more k’s … and acummulated more total-time-in-rain. These are the small (and irrelevant) victories I can still achieve.
Pro
vs
Middle-aged dude
9 Likes
Love the small victories! However I give the pros half a point for making Strava art - stick figure riding a bike.
1 Like
Those green bars are impressive, however, I suspect coasting/descending is included. And this can be up to 30% of training time, depending on where they train. And of course, green is not green. Lower green is a very different beast to upper green.
2 Likes
Ricky Bobby aka Quinn Simmons for sure is good example of pro training in Strava. Enough altitude, power and duration…
Based on the responses on twitter I assume not included. And absence of awareness that this “may” be an important factor. Let’s just take a look at Kwiatkowski’s Dauphine stage yesterday:
This is not the first time Zone 0 is included. Actually, I’m not really aware of any TID study where say took into account of this. This TID and polarisation index may work for sports like running or so. But with cycling, especially when looking at GTs, coasting/descending is a major factor. Including this inflates artificially Zone 1.
And I’m really surprised they don’t consider this. They work with pro data but miss this fundamental element. In the old days with HR only (like the famous Spanish U23) Zone 0 could not be identified. but now it should.
2 Likes
This part is included in the link that he responded to in the replies, so I assume that they use the same protocol or its the same study( havent looked into it further). So looks like they take out easy power and coasting that dont directly lead to significant adaptions. Hard for us to compare though at what intensity is 50% vO2max.
" Briefly, the intensity of Zone 1 incorporates low-intensity exercise greater than or equal to 50% of maximal oxygen uptake and lower than the intensity corresponding to the first lactate or ventilatory threshold."
1 Like
Ah, I missed this. Did not expect this to be described in the section Introduction.
Not sure if it was posted above, but seems the paper ref “How do world class top 5 Giro d’Italia finishers train?” is now available:
2 Likes
Just wanted to post this as well.
- it is pretty clear they did not exclude coasting/descending from the data
- they used 0.95 x CP20 for zone 2 and 3 boundary (which will yield a higher value)
- they use 0.85 x FTP for zone 1 and 2 boundary. they say this is a good surrogate for LT1 in pros. HOwever, they cite two old papers and base their assumptions on a correaltion of FTP and LT2 (with its thousands of different defintions)
Combining these inflates the green bars. It is without question that pros ride a lot of LIT but these bars look comical. And no one dares to call “emperor’s clothes” in the bubble.
And this paper will be cherry-picked by the Couzens of this world to form the current belief system.
8 Likes
What is the current belief system? Pros spend 60-70% of the time doing LIT. It is early in my time zone, i might be reading the paper wrong, but even if we assume the green bars to be inflated, at most, the yellow and red bars represent at maximum, 30% of the riding volume.
If you remove the coasting, What percent of LIT do you think they actually do?
it depends… on 1000 things. as much as possible is a good answer i think.
