Phil's Ice Legs

Just saw Phil’s new ice legs product, and the whole time I was thinking about how I recently heard somewhere that letting inflammation run its course is important for growth. I don’t know how much research there is on cryotherapy/icing vs letting inflammation run its course. Thought I’d come check in for what people here think of $200 for chilling their legs down ($150 with code LAUNCH at the moment if that changes the decision). Everyone here seems much more informed than myself, and would love to hear more than just his marketing speech

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Recommended the following read before spending any hard earned money on “recovery” devices/methods:

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I can attest that ice does indeed aid recovery.

I can’t however see how this $200 ‘invention’ is viable over using a half dozen normal ice packs strategically placed on your quads, calfs and hamstrings that would cost you about $20 from Amazon.

Seems like it’s an easier way to get those ice packs on your legs

Actually science if moving in the other direction. Sure ice feels good and reduces inflammation, but is that a good thing? There is a reversal in this traditional mindset (still controversial as of now) that questions reducing inflammation in this aspect actually being beneficial. During an injury applying ice blunts the bodies response to heal the affected area. Then the body has to wait for the area to warm up to go back to healing itself. Ice post exercise appears to reduce inflammation that the body would otherwise use to create adaptation. So in theory, the ice is negatively impacting the very benefits that exercise is trying to accomplish.

Inflammation in these contexts is not the devil as it was thought to be, but rather a natural process of the body repairing itself (hopefully building back stronger), so why would you want to inhibit this? However, ice feels so good and takes the pain away (by numbing), so it has to be beneficial right? Not to mention, people claim they “feel” better or are “less sore” after ice use (placebo affect). So I guess one must contend with how they “feel” post ice use versus whats is actually happening physiologically inside the body.

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That’s interesting fella.

I can only speak to my own situation but the next day my leg muscles are noticeably less fatigued and sore when I manage to get some ice packs on them for a solid 20 minutes, around an hour after exercise.

This in turn means I can train and progress on consecutive days - something i couldn’t do otherwise.

I wouldn’t take the latest scientific findings too seriously - sooner or later they tend to scientifically debunk their own data in some way or another.

I like to go by personal results. In this case if I disregard my own experience and stop using ice and the next day I’m unable to train as usual because of it, all the studies and tests in the world won’t be able to help me in the moment.

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For $180 dollars I think I can live with the hassle of placing ice packs on my quads.

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The pitch here is you’re paying the $199 one time to avoid all the hassle and mess of creating, using and cleaning up after an at home ice baths. If you’re an ice bath person, that’s worth way more than $199. It may be a niche market but this is a million times easier, and quicker than drawing a bath and dumping in a ton of ice.

Not mentioned anywhere I saw, but this holds potential for heat therapy too. The gel packs i have used for injuries were both freezable and microwavable.

What you’re referring to is the placebo/anticipatory affect. If you believe it works then it does and vice versa.

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Ice or no ice putting your legs up for 20 mins post ride would be a benefit. Is the ice just a reason to do that?

Probably other things Phil is using which would provide you with much more “recovery” power.

If you want to recover and be ready for the next day (i.e. during a stage race), ice is beneficial.

If you want to maximize your adaptation, you should avoid icing your legs or any type of anti-inflammatory aids like NSAIDs.

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This is how I understand things as well - reducing inflammation for athletics is good in competition but not for adaptation. It is also good for harmful inflammation during injury, but during training, let it run it’s course.

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Yup, this is how I understand it as well. Ice does help in reducing inflammation. Is this a good thing? Yes, if you don’t care about adaptation as much and want to perform again before allowing your body to fully heal itself. No, if you’re looking to reap the maximum benefit of your training.

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In this context its likely a balance between blunting inflammation and increasing circulation. Decreasing body temps below normal increases blood circulation that could potentially aid in recovery similar to massage. I think that is why there is not a consensus on this yet, unlike for example the use of NSAIDs to blunt the inflammatory response with no other benefit to counteract it

Where are you getting that information from? Everything I found says the complete opposite.

”The use of ice during the initial (acute) stage of an injury constricts blood vessels, which decreases blood flow to the injured area. The decreased blood flow helps to decrease swelling, inflammation, pain, and muscle spasm. Ice also decreases cell metabolism and helps to prevent tissue death.”

Heat causes the blood vessels to dilate, which increases the blood flow to the area. The increase blood flow will bring oxygen and nutrients to the injured area. It will also help to remove any metabolic waste that was created as a result of the injury.

In contrast to the application of ice, the application of heat will increase cell metabolism, which promotes healing. Heat increases the extensibility of muscle and connective tissue, which increases their receptiveness to exercise and stretching, therefore helping to increase flexibility and range of motion.

Heat can be used to increase blood flow to areas of chronic pain, tightness, and muscle spasm. Heat should not be used in the first 24 hours after an injury because it will cause an increase in swelling and inflammation.

Also, there is no proof that massage actually aids in recovery, let alone improving circulation better than anything else.

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Oh right, i misremembered the study, it was on contrasting cold/warm baths that increased circulation in particular to joints. Constriction followed by dilation led to increased blood flow

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ice packs on quads seem to work for me, by decreasing post training quad soreness allowing me shorter recovery between hard days. seems to cut a day or so off of recovery. Certainly not scientific, but helps me noticeably. Legs much less sore and are fresher the day after a hard workout or race

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Ice packs help me, by decreasing soreness on subsequent training days. Lying on the floor or a bed with feet propped up as high as possible on the wall, also seems to help (theory is blood drains from legs so you get fresher blood to damaged tissues later). I only do upper legs, where Phil’s invention seems like a good idea to get lower legs too

Not much and its not encouraging.