??
The default workout screen sucks, so TR giving you a way to make a better one doesn’t seem like creating a problem.
I find torque effectiveness (which Wahoo DOES support) to be valuable. It’s a good indicator of how efficiently I’m pedaling. It’s better than pedal smoothness IMO.
Admittedly the others might not be of much value. But that’s harder to judge since I haven’t been able to see that for myself. I don’t think it’s a big enough deal on its own for anyone to base their decision on.
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Yes.
There is a learning curve. And the more you use say an 840, the more you might appreciate the extra features. I like good tools. I didn’t “buy into” the Garmin ecosystem, whatever that means.
My first year on a bike I used RideWithGPS on an iPhone. Worked better than all the bike computers, then and now. Look no further if you want simplicity, ease of use, best display, great maps, etc.
The people I know that want the easiest, they sold their Wahoo or Garmin and went back to recording on Strava or RideWithGPS app.
I know a lot of people that can’t figure out how to use their iPhone or Android. I know that because they ask me for help on the simplest things. Thinking of that, and seeing some of these posts, I feel like Mr Hand in Fast Times at Ridgemont High 
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I too use Ride With GPS on my iPhone with ear buds when I’m somewhere that requires directions.
My Garmin 840 solars works just find for all the rest of my needs.
All depends what you want to spend your time and mental energy on I guess. A bike computer is something I want to just work, and to do so intuitively. If I need to search the internet or post on here to figure out a feature, that’s a UI fail in my view.
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Tbh I have not pushed a TR workout to my Garmin (only the Bolt), but its described in the “Executing a Workout” section on the following page - Take Your Training Outside: TrainerRoad Outside Workouts - TrainerRoad Blog
I think essentially this is a Garmin feature that a workout can end on a lap button and TR is just leveraging it for their outdoor workouts - e.g. unless you live somewhere exceptionally flat you are likely to have a section in mind to do a 10 or 20 min workout and arriving at the start of that section might not align with the countdown of 5 mins or so from the last interval
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You’re not wrong, but I would say I’m very much a tech enthusiast and a technical person (but and overlocked my own PCs, written some Python, done lots of CAE simulations, etc).
I find the Garmin interface overly complex and hard to remember. It doesn’t mean that I can’t use it. I would become proficient with it over time. But I wouldn’t like using it.
Similar to Mac vs Windows. I came from Windows, still use it for work, but man I love my Mac. That’s a preference, it does not reflect on the abilities of the user.
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I still - and will keep using until it dies - use an Edge 520. Haven had a handful of sync issues in 5,6 maybe 7 years.
The workout player in this unit is terrible. But I won’t spend CAD 400 on a new unit just because of that.
Said that, my next unit is likely to be a Bolt 2 due to the before-mentioned comments, particularly workout pause/play, data field zoom and those LEDs.
Yeah, for “fun” and better represent the company, I compile Linux and run it on embedded boards. Have taught some Raspberry Pi classes. Been using Unix since 1986, thats why I use a Mac. Versus Windows it has a better collection of tools for someone with basic programming and scripting skills, although later versions of Windows have gotten better.
My daughter FaceTimed last weekend, she was frustrated with assembling furniture. After getting her to slow down, turns out she was using a Phillips head screwdriver and impact driver, and the screw head was hex. This is the 3rd time its happened since moving ~8 months ago. She finds screw heads overly complex.
Screw heads are not intuitive.
I’ve taught my wife to start tapping inside apps. She finds the lack of standards on apps and websites to be overly complex. She is correct, this idea that apps and websites are easy to discover has led to all sorts of non-intuitive UIs and UXs.
Apps and websites are not intuitive.
Last week I wanted to dual record and outside ride (power pedals and crank power), should have just grabbed my 530. Instead I fired up the Wahoo app on iPhone, paired the crank power meter, and then started recording. But it didn’t record the power. While riding my warmup I clumsily (wearing gloves) stopped the ride and started tapping until I figured it out. Sorry, pairing into a profile and then not using is not intuitive. You can tell me “hey tiger, slow down” but I’m just going with the group think here and saying out loud that the Wahoo app is not intuitive.
Wahoo app is not intuitive.
Strava on smartphone makes it dead simple to record GPS and speed, but you can only pair a heart rate sensor. The UI is so simple (4 icons I think) that I found it immediately, but if you aren’t comfortable tapping stuff it wouldn’t be intuitive.
Strava app is intuitive for gps/speed/distance.
When I go to the gym the Stages bike automatically finds and connects to my heart rate monitor.
Stages SC3 bikes in the gym are intuitive.
Here is my 840 with a workout loaded:
From that screen I can swipe up to pause/FWD/RWD. For the 2nd target I could use HR instead of cadence, HOWEVER power and cadence are stress, and HR is strain. My workouts manipulate power and cadence, and HR is merely a response to those manipulations. I’m over 60 and can read that with or without prescription lenses.
Choice is good. I’m keeping my 2-minute real-time power graph and being able to see what I’ve recently done, and what’s coming up in a minute or two.
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@WindWarrior I’m guessing that’s a custom workout screen, you wouldn’t mind sharing what layout and options you’ve used, please? Looks spot on.
While we are talking about overly complex computer interfaces - here is a hot take
If your outdoor workout takes a special screen to follow it, it is overly complex for zero benefit. You should really only need a lap button, and a target power (or range).
I’m not sure of your point. I think you’re saying the same thing can be intuitive or unintuitive to different people.
That’s the point I was trying to make. I was pointing out that despite my ability, I still don’t like the Garmin interface, but that’s not a reflection of skill. Just because I like the Wahoo interface doesn’t mean it’s better either. To each their own, just like other preference debates.
Default workout screen on an 840. Fed from TrainingPeaks.
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And pause/back/forward interval. I really appreciate the side leds of the roam during workouts which indicate if you are under or overshooting the range and by how much, I generally look at those leds more than the actual power target. Which sort of answers my question: I’ll stick with wahoo. Now which one Bolt or Roam. The Roam v2 I just received (as well as the 1040), the order for the bolt for some reason got cancelled and I can’t be bothered to go to pick up the 840 from another pickup point atm.
I found the roam v2 for 320 euro now and the bolt v2 for 217 euro on amazon (that’s a really good deal). I unboxed the roam v2. The screen and buttons are a pleasant surprise. To bad I didn’t receive the bolt. I still wonder how much smaller the screen effectively is/ harder to read the bolt v2 screen is
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I don’t know if this helps, but on my Bolt v2 I could not read incoming texts because the font was too small. On my Roam v2 I can.
Yeah, no one wants to receive texts while riding. But it’s nice to know there isn’t anything urgent from my family. I had no idea with the Bolt v2.
If you want the leds then get the Roam, no question.
Default from TR looks different, I think based on what targets are specified by the workout. You get the dreaded “step distance” as the most prominent thing on the screen, which is useless and not customizable. I also get instant rather than 3s smoothed power, and average vs. current power are swapped. I dislike most things about this screen.
Default driven by TR would drive me crazy. I do nearly all my workouts outside, with workouts from TrainingPeaks. Several years ago I wrote a long post about step-vs-3sec power TR choice for workout export.
IIRC the “ghost intervals” were an attempt by TR to make it easier if you didn’t have long stretches of road to do the work with few to no interruptions. I think it would be better to embrace the default workout screen so the TR user can easily access the pause/play/RWD/FFD controls.
Maybe someday TR will embrace outdoor workouts on Garmin x30 and x40 devices, for now I still find there are too many compromises from pre to post workout.
Long story short, the TrainingPeaks workout editor and export are great IMHO. Sync workout to Zwift or Garmin and you can see ranges. Editing TP workouts on my iPhone is a challenge, but I have an 8 year old laptop in the garage and new laptop in my home office. Not an issue for me because I use a laptop.
On smartphones Intervals.icu has a “better” workout editor, because its text, but requires a little more finger tapping patience to select/delete/copy/add.
With garmin, its a numbers game, there are just so many units out there. if 0.000……x % had an issue, it would still be hundreds.
That said, as. member of the IT world it does appear the US companies have taken to “constant integration” in a big was and “acceptance testing” is now done by the users! SRAM is another big one for this with products released that seem to lack the maturity one would expect from a market leader.
Yes Fantasy, maybe 2-3 times a year my Garmin 530 uploads in less than 20 minutes.