Would have to look at your curve. But if you don’t have maximal efforts on the short duration it messes with the long duration stuff as well.
its using your power duration curve, so when the curve changes then interesting things happen Measuring/Estimating TTE (Time To Exhaustion) - #16 by bbarrera or https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/kolie-moore-podcast-wisdom/30520/473?u=bbarrera
welcome to the fun part of using WKO! FWIW I rarely look at TTE in WKO, it seems particularly sensitive to PDC and exactly what efforts are in the 90-day window.
^ this.
I did short/med/long tests this week, but it’s only the first “feeding”; last 30-90 days only lots of Z2/3 stuff.
I guess the real life ride should? supersede any algo test (TR ramp, WKO TTE, etc) result. 
There’s a ‘residuals’ chart that will show you where the model is confused. Test around those durations and it should tighten up. If you aren’t doing threshold work it doesn’t really matter what the model thinks though. So always ask yourself ‘why do I care and how is it going to change my behavior’ before you chase details.
Even then the residuals chart might not help much. That is similar to my training and on 5 December my coach prescribed an athlete’s choice “American Express” ride where my job was to go hit all the zones. I uncorked a 2-min effort that was within a few percent of all-time best from 4 years ago. So now my PDC is really confused LOL.
and ‘does the PDC actually reflect fitness with plenty of short/medium/long max efforts, or simply the training I’ve been doing?’
This, and something I just realised I was doing — valuing tech above my own observed performance. Tools for tools sake. 
Will amend workouts accordingly.
I decided to have a ago at along test the other day, may be a dumb question but how far to exhaustion do people go? I find the ramp test fairly easy in that regard as I go till I can’t turn the pedals, but with the long test, exhaustion sets in very slowly. I got to 50min but could have squeezed more out even though I felt pretty cooked, I guess I just gave up mentally?
either way my 50 min average gave me the same number as a ramp test 2 days prior. so I can confidently rely on ramp test numbers going forward. not sure i would want to do a long test every 4-6 weeks.
Nope.
Ramp FTP and TTE FTP – even though they may be the same number – are the result of different systems (or more precisely, a different mix of the same systems).
I’ve done both, a lot, and have got the same result from both, but I trust the TTE FTP far more than the ramp result. It also provides much more actionable information than a ramp test.
If you could’ve squeezed out another few minutes, it would probably make a minimal difference to FTP value (+/-1w) if you carried on at the same level. What I’d recommend is ramping the effort up if you’ve had enough until you actually reach exhaustion.
Exhaustion = Exhaustion
It was ‘I can rely’ rather than 'can I rely 
I understand your point though. Despite never having issues with the prescribed number from the ramp test I was curious in validation froma long test. I was expecting a lower number, but has been a valuable exercise nonetheless.
My point was that it is quite a physically and mentally taxing test, and would rather continue to use a ramp test if it works for me.
As this test was done at the end of a base block (some threshold, long S/S and lots of Z2) i am curious to do another test after a build block (ie lots of Vo2max work).
If you do that you might expect the top end training to drag up your ramp test number even if your FTP hasn’t actually moved. I don’t know that for sure though, it’s a question of whether your FTP as a % of top end power changes with training.
I see two benefits of the long test: first I believe the number more than a short test and setting an FTP too high for threshold intervals is a problem. Second it gives an idea of how much work to do to push yourself to improve.
For example, my TTE is not great so I am happy doing ten minute intervals that in total add up to my TTE. As I get fitter I would increase the interval length or number to reflect an improving TTE, which is (as he says on the podcast) progressive overload.
The bonus benefit is that the test is a pretty good threshold workout. He has done a couple of podcasts on threshold training, the second being a listener questions one. I feel like I learned a lot from both and I am really enjoying that aspect of training now.
Yes, this is exactly what I want to find out.
I’ve tested this test and ramp back to back a few times and its always different for me. The type of training u have been doing going into a ramp test can skew it up or down at times
Of course the relationship between FTP and Pmax changes. Bernal can put out 6 w/kg for over an hour but probably can’t sprint much higher than 10-12 w/kg. Track guys can do 10 w/kg for 60s but don’t crack 4 w/kg for 60min.
Both are dependent on genetic predisposition. Both are based on what training you do. The genetics and training to be good at one generally rob the other.
Two things. WKO5 adds some small noise to TTE because apparently it’s a highly sensitive output that could give away their algorithm. Secondly, I believe KM mentioned on the podcast it usually underestimates without truly maximal looooong efforts, like 2h+ IIRC.
That is what I assumed too. I know the ratio can vary widely between individuals, but I wasn’t sure to what extent it would be altered by training (e.g. an FTP block) for one person.
I’ve been able to do ~1000w from, basically, day 1. My FTP has gone up over 50% since I’ve started and it’s not unreasonable to think it could double eventually. If I could double my pmax… I would be thrilled.
MAP is far more closely related to FTP than to sprint power.
Had my first go at the baseline test today. Much less mentally taxing than the 20 minute test. It just confirmed what I’m currently working too, which is fair given how training has gone since Christmas. One thing I wasn’t sure of - I could probably have ground out a minute or two out of the saddle at the end?
Anyway, I have the ramp test scheduled for Thursday, so it will be interesting to see how that goes (I think mentally it may be easier with an “FTP” already banked) and how it compares.
For me the baseline test (or the other tests KM suggests) are also a very good workout. A ramptest doens’t have a value as workout (for me).