Dylan Johnson's "The Problem with TrainerRoad Training Plans": it's gonna be a busy day around here

SS is not really threshold, it is just around the point of high tempo/low threshold.

Bruce

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It is their plan. Ditto for the adaptations they suggest on the podcast. They also offer an option to replace many of the Sunday workouts with a Z2 equivalent. Listen and read up.

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As someone staring down the barrel of the last week of SPBLV, I’m extremely sympathetic to the view that default TR plans have too much intensity. I actually edited my plan to bring on a recovery week yesterday based on how I felt after my Sat workout. Now I’m having second thoughts and may add the last week of it yet ask back in.

Hopefully I’ll rally in time for Tuesday’s vo2max water-boarding.

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Welcome to the forums Jonas :slightly_smiling_face:

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The assumption that belies this very statement is what you are calling a strawman.

Dylan’s criticism can be grouped into 2 areas:

  1. Sweet Spot vs Polarized Training
  2. Rest

SS vs PT: IMO, the jury is still out. I have watched several of Dylan videos and read plenty here on the Forum contrasting both approaches, and remain unconvinced that one is better than the other.
FWIW: I have always subscribed to the SS approach and remain as such today.

Rest: It doesn’t take much knowledge to know the lack of sufficient rest in TR’s HV Plans, and for many even in the MV plans, can be detrimental to your health or, minimally, allow you to achieve optimal performance. I suspect that Coach Chad put together the HV plans as TR’s target audience seems to be the time-crunched athlete with the logic being that it is better to minimize rest than under-train an athlete that has capacity for more.

FWIW: When I joined TR back in Aug 2017 TR’s SS MV plan had too little volume for me. But I knew (no brainer) that HV was a bad plan physiologically from a rest perspective. So I used TR’s Workout Creator to achieve the volume I needed (i.e. longer sessions) while getting the rest on off days. In fact, my training looked more like LV in #days and exceeded HV in TSS.

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Here’s my time in zones (according to Golden Cheetah) from SS Base 2 over 6 weeks. My outdoor bike was being repaired so I would say I was around 95% compliant. Make of it what you will:

Z1 (active recovery) 32%
Z2 (endurance) 25%
Z3 (tempo) 20%
Z4 (threshold) 16%
Z5 (VO2Max) 5%
Z6 (anaerobic) 1%
Z7 (neuromuscular) 0%

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TrainerRoad offers three options for all their plans. Low, mid and high volume. They suggest all beginners to start at low volume. That’s 200-300 TSS per week spread over 3 working days and four off-days.

As per coach Chad, I haven’t heard him say that. Though bear in mind that he is also running and lifting. As always, it all comes down to our personal situations.

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There is a hell of a difference between doing 3x20 @ 90% and 3x20 @ 100%, both during the workout and the next day.

Bruce

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Literally doesn’t though. According to the plan builder is says “choose the option that best represents your average training per week, over the last six weeks”.

Must be another thing in the podcast lol

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I’m struggling to stay calm with this😅 He made three versions of dozens of plans to cater for the vast majority of what they see as the TR demographic,

Your position is that if the Coach can’t do all the plans, the plans are wrong.

This is descending into madness! :crazy_face:

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With respect, this is only partly accurate. Dylan does have a growing youtube franchise, but on the coaching front, he isn’t taking new clients (and I happen to know is actually turning them away). He has done interviews in the past in which he notes that his youtube channel is only a small portion of income. I agree that he likely wants to grow that, but I don’t think he is trying to draw clients for coaching.

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4y1ixb

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So basically you are just repeating what DJ said. He also mentioned that they give people the option to replace the workout with a long Zone 2 ride. You however make it sound like he never mentioned it which is wrong. You add zero value to this discussion with your last postings.

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Welcome to the forums Green :slightly_smiling_face:

So what appears in the app is “correct”? i.e. the most effective training possible for time available? Which study suggests that?

:sweat_smile:

Obviously, the plans are not perfect for everybody, so TR has suggestions for how to adapt them. If you don’t want to read/listen to those suggestions because of the time it would take to do so, then that is on you, not TR.

Bruce

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I think we’re operating on different levels/directions Chris, and never the twain shall meet. Good training :+1:

You were not clear in your explanation, you simply said you added more z2. I can’t read minds.

Still substituting one z2 ride in the high volume SSB2 plan still gives you 4 intensity days which is simply to much intensity for optimal gains.

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