How can I simply select the old training plans without all this new AI fluff?!
I simply want to add my mid base I training plan to my calendar. I don’t need/want AI to custom make me stuff - I just want access to the old plans..
There must be a way of seeing these?!
Are you hand-selecting workouts or just following the template of the phase?
I can’t see any benefit to following a stock template of workouts..
While they were good for that time, we have evolved intentionally and significantly!
To use a metaphor, we all had 9 speed drivetrains, super skinny tires and harsh riding wheels and frames back in 2012-2016, and while it was great at the time, bikes have evolved intentionally and significantly and the riding experience is SO much better now!
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If you just want a stock 12 week training plan, just go to Trainingpeaks and buy one off of their affiliated coaches. That is much cheaper than subscribing to TR. If you are going to pay TR, wouldn’t you want to benefit from all the tools that they have built?
Exactly. I’ve found it now and all good.
Been using TR for years, and I know what works and what doesn’t. I also know that I can train 5x a week, and that with my other activities and life, Monday will be recovery, Tuesday some hard intervals, Wednesday down the pub/rest day etc etc. I also know how much time I have on each of these days.
So yeah, maybe “AI” could do something different. But, wasn’t TR using sophisticated algorithms and machine learning way before it became “AI” anyway? Ramp tests to estimate FTP for example. Those plans were based on proper data anyway analysis anyway. I don’t need my plans to have “AI sparkles” all over. Feels like TR is just jumping on a bandwagon when actually it’s been doing it all along anyway.
I’m actually doing my first TR program in probably over a year. I have been mostly (and what I consider successfully) selecting training workouts based off a polarized model.
For a few reasons, I decided to mess around with training programs on the new AI system. I wanted 4 workouts per week, on certain days, with two intensity, one 2 hour endurance, then a long ride on the weekend. It built it nearly exactly how I wanted, and shifting workouts around is a breeze. I always want mondays and one weekend day off, and that’s mostly what it has done.
I’d suggest playing around with it a bit.
I’m 8 years and 1,600 plus workouts into my TR career. I loved the old plans, and adaptive training was good when you figured out how to use it, but this new AI stuff is way….. waaaaaay better than any of that. Not even close. Reverting would be a huge step back. I’ve seen a lot of older familiar form handles commenting on threads here and most are saying “wow, this is great,” but there are a few that are super resistant.
You may not like Jonathan’s analogy, but I think it holds. And I still know people that won’t put any less than 100psi in their tires
As for the new AI, I knew it was going to be great when I figured out that they had replaced Adaptive Training with AI workout selection several months ago. Workout failures went away, non productive intensity disappeared, and I started finally breaking through my years-long plateau.
My favorite part was taking my packed planned cycling schedule and seeing how many hours I could remove without negatively impacting FTP. Huge win for my family, my career, and my training.
I’d really encourage you to be more open-minded about this and give it more than a couple of weeks.
Not everyone is closed minded just because they dont use the new features. The new product doesnt work for everyone. What product does. Adjustments suggested are all about leaving the FTP the same. Since when did one number get so fixed in stone.‘
The workouts are beyond a level of being productive for me with my health issues. The simplest fix is to adjust the FTP. It does stop FTP prediction and was also warned by TR that workouts may not be the best.
My own rationale for the FTP drop is I wasn’t able to do the threshold workouts and the prediction was going back down. Why work at too hard of a level which the FTP prediction is clearly telling you that you are right. The FTP is too high. May be it should have been just half the increase. I went back to the most recent AIFTP number which was just before I did the detection.
I dont have an issue with it. I have logged around 1300 TR rides over the last 10 years or so. It isnt like I dont know how this goes.
It will take time for me to hopefully end up back to turning the FTP detection on. I really did like the automatic FTP determination before. Not that I thought it was 100% accurate.
We’re talking about following a non-adaptive stock training template here, right? That’s what pinning each workout to your calendar would achieve. My opinion is that there is no benefit to doing that over the adaptive plans that are available. 
That would be like having a coach write down your training for the next month or two and refusing to make any changes based on that data from your workouts along the way. 
You’re welcome to do things however you’d like, though! I’m just trying to help each athlete progress in their training as best as they can. 
The AI shit doesn’t work. You hardly ever train. every day after a threshold or sweet spot goes yellow or red.
So, having been told my FTP was 205 and would fall by a few percent over the next 12days I ramp tested and drew a 247 watt FTP.
The AI plans predict I will fall straight away as pictured below based on the AI adjusting plan. I only ride three TR workouts a week and a Saturday 2hour bunch “hard”.
Isn’t the whole point to adjust the plans to improve TR? @eddie ? Who’s driving this junket? Can I have Chad Timmermans plans back please?
would you not expect to be a bit less fresh the day after a threshold day?
You can choose the hours and days you train, but TR will warn you if it thinks it is too much.
Ramp tests are not a reliable way to test your actual physiological FTP.
Depending on one’s ability it’s extremely easy to over test using a ramp test.
TR’s aiFTP is a number that is used to set your threshold to around a 3.0 level workout, not necessarily to accurately reflect a physiological maximal metabolic steady state.
If you ask nicely I am sure TR would be happy to look at your training and give their advice, wether here publicly (with your permission) or elsewhere. 
If you check this very thread there is a way to access those old plans too 
If I only perform 15 workouts in 28 days and the Adaptaive planning can’t make those workouts “improve” me, what’s the point ? I can ride, have a day off then ride easy or hard as required to improve for four weeks.
To the contrary, the system shows I will decrease FtP based on those 15 planned workouts ( which are meant adapt in difficulty based on the collected data adapt to maximise gains)
I personally understand the Ramp test is far from perfect however TR have been saying it’s their best measure for years. How does the AI FTP detection (Based on 6 weeks of riding) and the current ramp test have a delta of 20%?
I’d be more than happy for TrainerRoad to explain this in the thread.
If you upload pictures of your calendar forum users might be able to spot something.
Otherwise I am sure @eddie can take a look during the week.
I’d be more than happy to see what’s going on with your training and discuss it here. Is it cool to consider that conversation here?
I’m sure we can get things working properly for you. 
Hi Eddie, yea that would be good.
I think that part of the reason you’re seeing so many red and yellow days is likely because you’re coming off a period of really low (no) training stress and ramping up pretty quickly.
Those red and yellow days are likely there for a good reason. An example of why I believe that is on April 25th, when you attempted a level 0.6 tempo workout on a red day and pulled the plug after 20 minutes due to “Training Fatigue.”
Also, you’re adding a fair amount of unstructured riding with power data to each week and not filling out the RPE surveys. A lot of those have really high IFs and therefore high TSS figures, which is likely also affecting those red and yellow days.
Since you’ve updated your FTP via a ramp test, the IF and TSS of those unstructured rides will likely come down a bit to more reasonable levels, and hopefully generate fewer red and yellow days, but filling in those RPE surveys is really important.
We may have had a low-confidence FTP Detection for you when you got back into training, but on April 14th, we only had a few unstructured rides and a level 0.9 threshold workout to use, and none of them had RPE surveys attached.
Moving forward, I’d add RPE surveys to all your completed activities and do your best to prioritize your scheduled TR workouts. If you need to adjust your schedule to make that happen, that’s totally cool! You could also go back and fill in RPE surveys for completed activities for which you can remember how the effort felt. All of that, alongside your updated FTP, will likely bring a better experience.
Let me know how it goes and if this helps!
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