Shimano Dura Ace 9200 [speculation]

Not going to happen. Even before Covid-19 I don’t think availability was great. But now you even have to wait for parts that have been announced >1 year ago. Case in point, I ordered my bike in January and it was assembled just this week. I originally wanted Red eTap AXS 1x cranks, but the ETA on them was Juneat the earliest. I had to “settle” for Force eTap AXS 1x cranks, and there was exactly 1 (!!) pair in 165 mm in all of Japan.

So I wouldn’t expect that Shimano’s new Ultegra groupset will be readily available in quantity. You’ll set yourself up for disappointment.

Yeah, I’m not expecting Shimano to change. I just wish they’d skip announcing ultegra 12s in 2022, and wait for 2023 when the OEM bikes are just being announced, and have groups/parts avaiable at the same announcement. Which was it, DA9000? that was announced and availability took forever, and then the power meters never really seemed to be available and that new rear freehub didnt seem to come out too.

Pretty sure their MTB 12s groupsets had the same issues, XTR got announced but by the time it was widely available the tech already trickled to Deore

You know what they say, good things are worth waiting for. There’s no amount of discount that would entice me to buy a SRAM bike, unless it was enough to yeet it for Shimano at no extra out of pocket

My buddy just got a Madone SLR7 with Force AXS and it weighs 18.4lbs where the Ui2 is 17.8. That 12th cog must be made of iron. Madone with DaDi2 is 16.8lbs whereas Red AXS is 17.3

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I’m on the fence with AXS. I had it on my previous bike. I currently run UDi2.

There were some things I really liked. The shift logic is super simple, the wireless is clean, and - the biggest for me - was the gear ratios. 48/35 and 10-33 solved a lot of problems for me, some of them admittedly theoretical. Indeed, tbh the 48-10 and 35-33 combinations saw very little use, but if I was planning to take the bike abroad - this is pre Covid, obviously - they are ratios I’d want, and that setup gave me them without any hassle or extra spend. It would also be an easy bike to travel with; just pop the batteries into hand luggage. I liked the way it synced to my Wahoo without any extra wires or spend, I liked the app, and I liked the reassurance of a spare battery in my jersey pocket, though I never used it.

I wasn’t wild about the weight, though in the real world I think it’s c.300g max heavier than UDi2, and unless you’re a high-level racer at the sharp end of a mountain finish that’s an irrelevance. It’s a bit more spendy than UDi2 but again, neither is cheap. Both points in UDi2’s favour, but not deal breakers.

The discs rubbed a bit but then so does my current Shimano UDi2. Weirdly, the 105 setup on the winter bike almost never rubs, and the brakes are at least as powerful, but that’s a side issue. Stopping power was about equal.

What I really didn’t like was the AXS FD. Chain drops weren’t an every ride occurrence by any means, but they were common enough always to be in the back of my mind. And to make it even more unpredictable, it wouldn’t happen for 5-6 rides, then would happen twice in 20km. My current UDi2 has dropped the chain once in over 2000km.

Having weighed all this up, my incoming bike has… Campag :rofl:

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Wireless just sounds so so good for easy setup.

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How often do you really have to set up a bike though? I’ve had my Di2 fitted for like 3 years now and I took the derailleur off once just to clean the jockey wheels good

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Just that the day I have all the parts for a bike, I can build it one night after the kids are down, and I won’t have to burn the midnight oil. When I have to do cables and adjustments, it just adds more time.

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Tbf I was just talking about the aesthetics. Installation advantages are moot for most users :+1:

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Aesthetically I like the look of the Shimano derailleurs more, they are much slimmer and seem more fitting on a road bike. The AXS derailleurs are huge, even without the batteries hanging off the back, I find it looks fine on my FUEL EX but a bit out of place on the latest slim aero light road bikes. The little 2” section of wire going to the Ultegra RD isn’t as visually unappealing. I also wonder how much more aero drag those hogs create :thinking:

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It’s odd how personal aesthetics are: I actually rather like the sort of industrial look of AXS, though I agree it would look a bit weird on a slim tubed, classic road bike.

It’s a bit of a shame really. I really want to like AXS, because I think on paper it’s a better system for most users’ needs. The thing is, it just doesn’t work as well as Di2. If they can sort the FD I’d be very happy to reconsider it on my next bike (though if the other half has her way, that won’t be for a loooong time :rofl:)

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My new bike has SRAM Force eTap AXS, and I have ridden a few bikes with Ultegra Di2. My bike is 1x, so I can’t speak to front shifts, but In my experience eTap works a lot better than Di2. The UI alone is kilometers better, the buttons have a more positive (and less chintzy) feel, (rear) shifts are positive and just happen. The 10-36 cassette I have has excellent gearing, too, it feels like a 11-32 cassette with an additional gear. If there are any speed differences, I can’t tell. Braking (disc) is much better, too.

So you’re saying DA9200 is coming out when?

This cassette will be my gearing of choice for my upcoming mountain epic. 35/36 sounds like tiny gearing, but there is an 11% climb of 8km in length. That’s 35/36 is 84 cadence @280W @70kg rider weight.

Regarding, DA9200, there are no news and I wouldn’t expect anything of relevance until a certain race in France.

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I live close to the mountains and I wouldn’t mind another climbing gear or so. Some of the inclines are rather steep, so the cadence with 42:36 = 1.17 (my gearing of choice) is still quite low even though I am putting out 300+ W (at 75 kg). Now this is still easier than 34:28 = 1.22 or 36:30 = 1.2 I’d always favor having more climbing gears even if they “only” allow you to spin faster at the same power. A 35:36 = 0.97 or 33:36 = 0.92 sounds kinda nice for long days out in the mountains with long, sustained climbs.

Regarding the new DuraAce Di2, even if it is announced, I don’t expect it’ll be available for months. I ordered my bike in January and I picked it up in late April. I originally wanted a Red crank, but that meant waiting at least until June. Plus, I think Shimano’s gearing will be way less flexible and have narrower gearing ranges. IMHO the 10-36 cassette should be the default option if you live in a mountainous area, even on a 2x. The steps feel great (perhaps because I used to run 11-32 cassettes with the same/very similar steps between the gears).

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Interesting - so glad the R9000 was mentioned - what a beauty that groupset is!

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I’m not a fan of the look of that crankset. I wonder if they will have fixed the issues that dual sided shimano crank based powermeters have had in the based

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From the spy shot, it looks symmetric, so probably yes. But we should know soon enough once @GPLama and @dcrainmaker get their hands on it.

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Yeah, that crank is ugly.

Like the brifter design, though!

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That might be the new crankset, but there is no way that’s the production chainring, I’m sure it’ll look nicer when the chainring properly blends into the crank.

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