Are there any users here who have first hand experience with both Shimano Ultegra Di2 R8150 and SRAM Force eTap AXS (both 12 speed, latest version)?
I am contemplating getting the new Canyon Aeroad CF SLX 8, and these bikes come in two builds that are identical in all aspects except the groupsets, aesthetics (which the Shimano version wins), powermeter (the Shimano build has 4iiii while SRAM has their own Quarq), and the price (the SRAM version is marginally cheaper).
The Shimano version is reportedly 300 grams lighter, but the 300 grams will according to BestBikeSplit save me perhaps 10-20 seconds up the Alpe dâHuez, 10 seconds on a 90 km undulating course I often ride or 2 minutes across the Tour des Stations (240 km with 9,000 ascent metres). In other words, the weight savings/gain is at best marginal, and the price difference is also negligible.
So that leaves me with a question that may be of interest to many other readers: Given that you have experience with the groupsets, which one would you go for and why? Any and all relevant arguments are much appreciated!
Iâve had the same debate on the exact same bikes. Iâve come up with 2 answers.
Team Shimano since it appears that replacement parts or making any changes to the groupset is more cost effective all else being equal (no idea if this is actually true).
But my real answer is ⌠which ever bike becomes bike of week first and becomes 10% off.
Iâm almost certain that 12spd shimano uses the same mounting points as 11spd so dzero should work for 12spd also. It may not match up aesthetically as well though.
I work in a bike shop, and while I havenât ridden the Canyons, Iâve ridden a lot of groupsets in the last few weeksâŚ
In terms of non-biased facts, the Shimano is more efficient than the SRAM, mostly due to the SRAM flat top chain and the 10t cog. So, if youâre concerned with gaining every small advantage, that may be good to consider. However, the Shimano powermeter is a joke, and everyone knows it. I would not trust anything that thing spits out, itâs accurate about as often as a broken wristwatch.
In my personal opinion, Iâd go with Shimano and get a third party PM if you have the cash. The Shimano shifts faster and âbetterâ (again, personal opinion), and I just enjoy the âfeelâ more. Iâve had both SRAM RED and Shimano Dura Ace on my bikes, and Iâll always choose Shimano from now on.
OP said the Shimano build had a 4iii power meter. There are no major issues with those. If you have a Garmin bike computer, Shimano Di2 allows you to control the screens from buttons on the hoods. As others have mentioned, testing has shown Shimano chains to be more efficient probably saving you more time than the weight savings.
Overall, I think my post in this thread is still up to date and covers pretty much all points.
TL;DR
Both are great groupsets.
Do not waste money on a Shimano power meter.(*)
Ergonomics (hood shape, buttons, etc.) >> features. Subjectively SRAM wins by a kilometer, even though I came from Shimano mechanical, I kept on mis shifting even after two weeks on a Di2 loaner. 0 mis shifts with SRAM. And I vastly prefer the hood shape.
SRAM has more and more flexible gearing options.
The 10-tooth cog (lower efficiency, blablabla) does not matter in practice, especially for us amateurs. It is fine.
Other features such as shift speeds or âshift qualityâ do not matter in practice.
(*) Even if you go for a Shimano groupset, get a Quarq Red-level crank, a Quarq power meter that mounts Shimano chainrings and use that. Rotor cranks are a great alternative. Or use Assioma pedals.
Edit:@Power13 has me beat, yes, get the red bike. Red bikes are the second fastest, they are only beaten by yellow bikes.
I donât think thatâs universally correct, pricing depends on where you live. I live in Shimano land (aka Japan), so we actually pay more for Shimano gear than if I were to order it off of bike24 or so. One factor to consider is that SRAM gear is less common, so you might not be able to walk into a LBS and pick up a pair of brake pads for your brakes. But if you order online, pricing and availability are comparable in many markets.
sure but a Red crank with power meter gives you no options on the crank. And then there is this:
In a perfect world Iâd have stuck with Shimano, it does feel like it shifts faster and although practically it doesnât matter, sometimes the shifts are slightly delayed and thats annoying.
I donât think your sentence makes logical sense. (Maybe you hit reply too soon, happens to everyone.)
What do you mean? Did you mean that going for Red cranks gives you no options on chainrings? The Red, old Force and Quarq D1/D2 cranks are compatible with Quarqâs DFour power meter, which mounts Shimano chainrings. Officially, it is compatible with 11-speed chainrings, but as @mhandwerk pointed out, they seem to be compatible with 12-speed chainrings, too.
I mentioned efficiency (âthe 10-tooth cogâ) and shift speeds. Like I wrote, I think neither matter in practice.
Theyâre both excellent groupsets. I think that red and purple looks awful, but I have 2 black bikes and a matte orange bike, so what the heck do I know anyway!?
Pros for shimano - like the shifter shape better, so much easier to bleed brakes. I like the brake feel better.
Con for shimano - I find it hard to feel the 2 different buttons when wearing thick winter gloves, so I have my di2 shifters setup sram style, with the right hand moving both FD and RD outboard, left inboard
Pros for sram - shifting is much more intuitive to me. In house power meter still regarded as one of the best
Con - brake bleeds are a pain in the ass, small chainrings are weird to me, even if itâs technically a bigger gear with the 10 tooth
I swap wheels between my road and cx bike and had the road di2 first, so I went shimano on the cx bike with same size rotors to make the swap effortless.
Some purples work, but I agree, this one ainât it. I really like the purple the CAAD12 special edition came in.
And orange is a great color. Iâm over black, there is too much black in the world. Whatâs the point of getting the equivalent of a sports car and pick a subdued color?
I personally prefer SRAM hoods and shifters. I find it much more intuitive. Every time I go from my SRAM bike to my Shimano one, I screw up a few Shimano shifts. It never happens the other way around. I must have the only one, but my Shimano front derailleur drops chains. Shimano does last longer, but SRAM is easier to charge, and in an emergency you can swap the batteries. Shimano brakes are better. Shimano replacement parts are far easier to get your hands on. Not a fan of the red and purple combo.
The compatibility chart you posted only pertains to SRAM groupsets, not Shimano.
Quarkâs D1 crank is a relabeled Red crank. The D2 is a relabeled last-gen Force crank. Both are compatible with the DZero and DFour power meters. The two only differ by their chainring mounting options. The DZero is for SRAM chainrings and the DFour for Shimano 11-speed chainrings. But they also seem to be compatible with 12-speed chainrings. So I could mount the power meter and chainring combo that @mhandwerk posted directly to my Force cranks in lieu of my DZero power meter and 1x chainring.
You donât need to go with SRAM 2x power meter chainrings. Not sure they anre even compatible with Shimanoâs 12-speed groupsets.
