Returning to TR with Adaptive Training After Several Weeks of Illness

Training
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I was looking for a thread that discussed returning to TR training after illness (or other) but everything I found was quite outdated as it didn’t consider Adaptive Training, AI FTP detection, etc.

Because I think that this is something many around here have to deal with occasionally (and this year may be particularly so; at least over here in Germany I know a whole bunch of people who suffered from week-long coughs or similar enduring issues), I thought the topic is worthy of a thread.

Here’s my specific situation: I had a nasty cough that stopped me from training for seven(!) weeks. Now the cough has finally vanished and I am back on the trainer. When starting TR it suggested various adaptions as expected. It had me start with a Ramp Test and offered AI FTP detection. I went for the latter. Good idea?

Q1: Is AI FTP detection reliable/a good idea after several weeks of illness?

In my case, my FTP was reduced by 12 watts. My first scheduled workout when coming back was a 90-minute VO2 Max session (more on that in a second) which I changed to a 1h VO2 max workout due to time constraints. It was classified as “Stretch” and I completed it with “very hard” perceived exertion - so my first impression is that the AI FTP was pretty accurate. But that’s only one data point and I’m curious to hear from other users and the team.

Q2: Is it good practice to re-start training with very high intensity work or would it be advisable to smooth the athlete into riding again?

For me, going hard from the get-go worked out fine. Yet I’m wondering what would be the go-to practice among good old-fashioned human coaches.

On that note, wouldn’t it be a good idea for adaptive training to ask a user who skipped several workouts for the reason why? I could well imagine that the optimal strategy to get the athlete going again varies, depending on what happened - say illness, injury, traveling, work stress, or lack of motivation.

Q3: Should I go back in time in my training plan or not?

The last topic I’m wondering about is whether or not I should move a few weeks back in my training plan. As said, I missed about 7 weeks, which in my case translates to having only done 2 weeks of my build phase. Adaptive training now has me jumping right into specialty. I assume the answer here likely varies depending on the existence (and timing) of goal events.

In my case, I don’t have any particular event I’m targeting. So at least from a timing perspective, I could easily go back to build. Would you recommend this or not? And if so, how would I do this in the TR interface? In the “Edit Block” menu, I can only choose from other specialty phases but not go back to build or base training.

And assuming I had a target event, say in 6-8 weeks from now, what would you recommend then?

Looking forward to any input on the subject!

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I realize you didn’t have COVID, but the return to exercise still applies. Check out this thread…

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I had a similar situation this winter as well. Got the flu and had a bad cough and a fever. I was wondering the same question myself directly after being ill. After I started to feel a bit better I did some endurance rides. I knew I wasn’t going to be able to get back into intensity for a few weeks. I did 2 weeks of endurance before jumping back into my TR plan. I did try an achievable threshold workout after about 10 days and had to bail because it was way too hard.

I was hoping that TR and the AI would take into account the calendar annotation that I was sick and lower the intensity of my plan for a few days after but that was not the case. I had to make all the adjustments on my own. The hard part was that I had just used AI FTP detection a few days prior to getting sick and so I couldn’t use it to get an accurate picture of my fitness post illness. Fortunately I’ve been using TR for a few years now and have a pretty good idea of what the different workouts in the different energy systems feel like and can make a pretty good guess at what I can/can’t do.

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Thanks for sharing. It’s true that I have totally forgotten about calendar annotations as a tool. Is there any info out there on how the AI uses information provided in annotations?

That said, I still think it’s too hidden a feature and the TR team could develop a better UI so users provide this type of data/feedback.

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This is an issue with TR in my opinion. The first time I took time off due to an injury for a week and returned following TR adapted workouts I was given Vo2 30:30s and barely completed it. Then the next workout was what should have been an easy/moderate sweetspot which I had to lower the intensity to complete. two days later I had the worst DOMS I have ever experienced and had to take 4 days to recover. This was a big hit psychologically as I had to take time off trying to return from time off.

Any time I return from time off for any reason, I begin with a week of easing into it. I really wish TR would do this with AT but they don’t.

What works for me is to take a week to ease back into the training by working through the training zones leading up to the one that represents the first regular workout. I always start with a custom endurance workout that has a long warmup ramp.

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My suggestion is to not approach this as rocket science. Just ramp or guestimate a reduced ftp en make a new plan

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@Jonathan mentioned on the forum that AI FTP would be able to lower or detect decreased FTP during the 28 days locked period. Is that really true and how does it work and could it have helped here @ZackeryWeimer ?

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Hey there! Sorry to hear about the illness, but glad to hear you’re recovering and getting back into training!

Q1: Is AI FTP Detection reliable/a good idea after several weeks of illness?

Yes! It will still be reliable. AI FTP Detection will recognize how time off affects your FTP, and Adaptive Training will adjust your Progression Levels during that time off period as well.

A rating of “Very Hard” for a VO2 Max workout is about what we’d expect, so it sounds like AI FTP Detection and AT have you locked in! :muscle:

Q2: Is it good practice to re-start training with very high-intensity work or would it be advisable to smooth the athlete into riding again?

Adaptive Training will adjust your plan based on what you missed, so if you accept the adaptations proposed by AT, you’ll be on the right track.

It looks like you added an illness annotation to your TR Calendar, but may not have accepted adaptations. In the future, if you choose to accept proposed adaptations from a time off annotation, Adaptive Training and Plan Builder will adjust your plan to cover you for the training you missed.

That said, some athletes prefer to ease into training rather than jumping right back into their plan, so using Workout Alternates or TrainNow will give you some flexible options if that’s what you prefer.

AT will take those rides into account as well, which means you’ll get further adaptations to steer your training in the right direction should you choose to ease back into things.

Q3: Should I go back in time in my training plan or not?

It is not necessary to go back in time in your plan. This goes for either case you mentioned – whether you have a goal event coming up or not.

Adaptive Training will rebuild your plan following your illness, so you’ll be placed back where you need to be to rebuild any fitness you may have lost.

@Rizzi as for your question, that is true! This feature will be coming with an update to AI FTP Detection :soon:

Feel free to let me know if you have any additional questions, and wishing you a smooth transition back into training!

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Hey Zackery, thanks for your detailed feedback!

Just to be sure: I accepted all adaptations AT had when I came back and accepted my new (lower) FTP. Since, I added a goal event and had my training plan restructured and the only adaptations I hadn’t accepted when you looked into my account were the ones that AT had after my last workout which I accepted now.

However, I only added the illness annotation after I had accepted all adaptations and started training again. Thus, in case AT comes up with different solutions for how a user should restart training based on the annotation type in the calendar, it could not take my illness into consideration as it did not know about it when suggesting the initial adaptations. (And to double down on my UX/UI point, I don’t think annotations are the optimal way to gather this data type from user :sweat_smile:) .

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I was out for about 5 weeks after surgery and a chest cold and AI detection backed me off 15W from an FTP of 208, I’m 57yo and 75kg.

The first workouts were VO2max affairs that were too brutal, so I selected alternate workouts. 2 weeks later, I’m still struggling to finish workout without adjusting the percentage levels.

I think AI FTP is doing its job, by probing and adapting my energy systems. That said, not a lot of endurance recommendations, which would help ramp back up from injury.

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Thanks for sharing! Just one follow-up question: did you have an annotation “injury” in your calendar before you had AT adapt your plan or not?

My current hypothesis is that the algorithm does take annotations into account but is not super sophisticated about it. In the case of injuries - and especially because it doesn’t have any further insights into the kind and severity of the injury - that’s probably a good thing: the software doesn’t even pretend to give you optimal recommendations which it (maybe?) should leave to your doctor anyways. (The counter-argument would be that, given sufficient quality data in the dataset, an AI could give better recommendations than most doctors for the majority of cases.)

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If we feel it got it wrong and we do a ramp test will a decrease in the ramp test train the model better for predicting future drops in fitness from time off? (I was having back pains so was off the bike for a bit and had a bike fit along with some hard hikes)

Some of us don’t have the experience to know how a workout should feel. This could be useful to know at the start of a workout to know if workout intensity should be adjusted.

But doesn’t the time off cut into the section you are in. So if in base you’ll be entering build with less base. Also the rest week is still at the same point, right?

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If we feel it got it wrong and we do a ramp test will a decrease in the ramp test train the model better for predicting future drops in fitness from time off? (I was having back pains so was off the bike for a bit and had a bike fit along with some hard hikes)

If you do a Ramp Test, it will help dial in AI FTP Detection – the more data it has, the better it will work!

Some of us don’t have the experience to know how a workout should feel. This could be useful to know at the start of a workout to know if workout intensity should be adjusted.

Fair point – we also don’t want athletes to overthink things too much, though. In general, workouts at Threshold or higher will probably be Hard or Very Hard. When it comes to post-workout surveys, we advise that you respond as naturally as you can based on how you felt during the workout.

But doesn’t the time off cut into the section you are in. So if in base you’ll be entering build with less base. Also the rest week is still at the same point, right?

In this instance, the annotations on the TR Calendar can be a little confusing. If you add a Time Off annotation, Adaptive Training will push the types of workouts you missed up to where you currently are – so while it may say “Build,” you’d still be doing “Base” workouts from the Base phase you missed as you get back into the swing of things.