Wow, might actually tip me over the edge.
I’ve been oohing and aaahing on Fascat for a bit.
I am quite constrained, time wise.
My usual schedule is to have morning rides on the trainer on Monday/Wednesday/Friday and, every 2-3 weeks a long ride at the weekend.
I used to add the Tuesday Z2 ride to my LV plan but I think it was a bit too little rest and my knee started to suffer.
Do you guys think the Fascat plan would cater for the same kind of schedule?
Fascat will have you doing as a basic template
:
Monday -off
Tuesday - Sweet spot
Wednesday - Slightly shorter tempo and later sweet spot intervals
Thursday - mostly Z2 rides with the occasional sweet spot later
Friday - rest
Saturday - long ride with sweet spot /tss goals
Sunday - 2 + hour z2 or sweet spot if Saturday was Z2
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With that schedule, i would stay with TR. i have a bunch of Fascat plans. This year, I am doing a combo of FC and TR this year, TR workouts during the week, the longer FC workouts on the weekend. The FC stuff is really designed around outdoor riding, TR is a bit more interesting inside.
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Yup, if i’m required to do 5 rides a week, it’s not going to work
I’m tempted to look at the Fascat plans as that structure really suits me - some indoors midweek but easy to transfer outside. I’m generally happier outside, although this autumn I’ve really enjoyed loads of time on the rollers doing SST & tempo.
My big question/concern with these plans is that they seem to start with very short intervals that would be well below where I’d usually start - 3x12 SST, 3x10 tempo etc - just feels like I’d want to start about week 4. It just feels like anyone with a reasonable base fitness would find that a much too easy start point? I guess thats the downside of these ‘cookie cutter’ plans that need to appeal to a broad audience.
I do like the idea of a planned progression and some proven structure so might take the plunge if there is a good discount!
I started the 18 week plan in week 5, and pretty much did the intervals as planned. Had some setbacks and even with less consistency, I ended up with higher power. So I like to say “less is more” and “fresh is faster” and over last 2 months I’m doing “less” vs TR SSB plans and yet my nose breathing aerobic power is higher than anytime except just before a long base/build preparing for a double century when FTP was about 20W higher.
Matt25 reached out to Dylan Johnson and he said:
“It’s ok to let go of intensity. It’lll make you faster in the long run” is what I did and its working.
@batwood14 found the same to be true, using a Canadian Coach Steve Neal.
As always, your mileage may vary.
A bit late to the party here, but to respond to the initial inquiry, I recently signed up with Empirical Cycling’s Coach Alex. I haven’t been with them long enough to give you any insight on any progress/power gains, but I’m enjoying the workouts thus far. In the first few weeks we have gone “back to basics” a bit with mainly Zone 2 rides including cadence/sprint drills, with the goal of pushing up overall volume/time. We are set to pick up the intensity a bit next week (Thanksgiving week, so I’ll have an excuse to work off all the turkey). Coach Alex is incredibly responsive, willing to explain the rationale behind a particular assignment or workout, and routinely checks in and comments with insights on my TrainingPeaks workouts. We had a productive discussion about my training history, goals, athletic characteristics/injury history, work situation, etc. before I signed up, and he delved into my history on TrainingPeaks before prescribing the first block of workouts based upon what he saw there. I think it is going to be a productive relationship.
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I’m a bit concerned about that too, however, especially in the first few weeks, I would stick to the prescribed workouts and potentially add more Z2.
There’s currently a 50% discount with the code “FAST50”.
I’m evaluating their plans at the moment, it’s a bit confusing since some plans are bundles of other plans, but I think that with a 100$ budget I’ll get a great resistance training and Sweet Spot Base plan.
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Same experience working with FasCat’s Coach Isaiah. Wish I had done this earlier, but it took getting kiddo #1 “off the payroll” and #2 will graduate in (almost exactly) a year.
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thanks - didnt realise that code was available!
Only question now is whether to go Inter or Adv? If it was mostly indoors I’d go Inter but I’m regularly over 12hrs if outdoors mostly. Hmmm…
I have the same doubt, but IIRC they will swap the plans for free if you want to change it.
Edit:
Q: What if I buy the basic plan but want to switch to the intermediate?
A: Send an email to help@ and they will switch out your plan at no charge.
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even better!
TBH, I looked back through Strava and most months are <12hrs per week, and the big weeks are because of long social or event rides rather than ‘training’, so Inter would be fine I think.
would be easier to buy intermediate and just add z2 time as you have it available. If you find that isn’t enough have them swap it out. This is what they told me the difference was between intermediate and advanced ( and you can also see how easy they are to work with). I agree with Bbarerra about a custom coaching plan. I was with them years ago and they are wonderful, it just isn’t in the budget right now. ( my youngest son is the one with the custom coaching plan now):
Hey Alex!
To answer your question, it is both an increase in total hours and in the length of the intervals. During the first 3-6 weeks of the plans the length of the intervals are pretty similar, but the weekend rides are longer and include more time in SS. As you progress, the intervals during the week in the advanced plan get harder too (e.g. 4x10 SS bursts in intermediate plan vs 5x10 SS bursts in the advanced plan). To help you get a better idea of the difference in the total hours, I am attaching a chart below.
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thanks - interesting to see the differences.
As stated it not just the extra time in Z2, there are more intervals and sometimes they are longer in duration in the advance plan.
I purchased a few advanced plans knowing that I could just reduce or omit an interval, as it happens I didn’t need too. Although the Diabolical workout in the last two week weeks of SS3 require lots of rest and getting your head in a good place before tacking them. 
Thanks for the detailed reply.
I’m still torn, but may just take advantage of the offer to satisfy my curiosity and give me something to try in future. It’s interesting you say you don’t feel as fit though - I have often wondered if the TR plans would work as well if you swap out the weekend intervals for some outdoor riding, and thats almost what the FC plans look like from the samples and discussions I’ve seen.
Right now I just want to get fit for Liege Bastogne Liege in April !
Depending on your plan, some of the workout / weekly tips specify that you can substitute the (typically) Sunday sweet spot ride with a longer endurance ride. I know the sweet spot base mid and high volume plans state this. Not sure of all of the others.
SSB-HV Week 2 Tip: If you’re not feeling up to another day in the Sweet Spot by the time you reach Sunday, try Ochoco or Ptarmigan instead.
GB-MV Week 2 Tip: Wrap things up with another round of Sweet Spot repeats, ones that force you to employ an intermediate recovery such that you recognize the upside of keeping your legs only slightly fresher over the course of longer intervals. Again, go the longer/slower route by skipping Juneau in favor of something like Town Hill or Boarstone +3.
I’ve NEVER hit a CTL of 90, and “when I was fast” in 2017 my CTL was 65-80.
Seriously how many following TR plans are likely to start base training with a 90 CTL? Looking at the TR plans, I’d guess its pretty rare.
In fact if you follow TR plans, you will NEVER hit 90 CTL. If you follow TrainerRoad SSB1 > SSB2 > General Build > Climbing Road Race progression the highest CTL you reach is:
- 82 CTL for High Volume (at end of SSB2, and at end Build)
- 63 CTL for Mid Volume
- 36 CTL for Low Volume
So your 90 CTL puts you in a pretty unique set of users, relative to someone that follows TR full progression.
For context FasCat’s 18-week intermediate sweet spot ends with highest CTL just above 80.
I know we exchanged private messages, don’t remember if you called FasCat to discuss. I did see you post on the forum and ask to exchange Advanced for Intermediate.
Given you started with a training load above the highest CTL of Intermediate plan, that was a legitimate concern going in and the result was not surprising.
I’ve done TR High Volume SSB-1, it was the first plan I did. Managed just fine but relatively small bump in FTP and got burned out on 5 days a week of sweet spot. Have also done TR’s Mid Volume base plans, and to be honest those had too much intensity.
TR Mid Volume base ends around 54 CTL, and as mentioned already I found it had too much intensity. I mostly followed FasCat’s base plan but had a couple interruptions, so during the spring my CTL only made it into the mid 50s. Despite that it improved my entire power curve vs TR. Almost got back to 2017 fitness, and actually set some under 30-sec power PRs at fifty eight years old (the rest are from 2016 and 2017, when I was loosely following CTS plans).
Anyways wanted to provide some perspective. Response to training is individual, and as they say your mileage may vary.
p.s. @iamholland color me jealous on starting with a 90 CTL !!
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They recommend advanced only if you are below 40 and have minimal disruption from work. I have their intermediate strength plan and I have tagged on the odd bit of Z2 but generally find it is plenty. And for context I use HV on TR
Not started their other plans yet to know the intensity and fatigue build up.
I’ve always done that, starting with CTS/Strava then TR then FasCat. Working with a coach it’s honestly the most I’ve FTFP. With this newfound consistency I’m hoping to hit my stretch goals next year. 