🎉 🎉 New Feature: Group and Solo Rides in Plan Builder! 🎉 🎉

[AndrewBl]

I’ve scanned the thread and haven’t seen the answer so I’m just gonna ask the collective:
Designating rides as solo or group rides, or anything for that matter…why would I do this? I feel like I’m missing an important use of T.R.

Currently, if I want to go on a ride, I go.

Later I designate it as the assigned ride it most closely approximates from a nearby day. Or if it doesn’t approximate anything I don’t . Then I let T.R. label the subsequent yellow/red days and adjust the following workouts accordingly.

I believe these rides aren’t used in calculating my progression levels (correct me if I’m wrong). And as long it’s a power-metered ride it can be used for a AI FTP detection . Again, correct me if I’m wrong.

I’m a “seasoned” rider, and at this point my FTP isn’t likely to go anywhere but level if I’m lucky.

My occasional runs and twice weekly strength training aren’t factored into R.T. though, and I already have to account for that using my own sense of fatigue level and experience.

So in the end, I’m using T.R. for a rough, but not comprehensive, training plan and most importantly to structure my interval training and drive my Kickr’s erg mode.

So how would I benefit from designating rides as Solo or Group ?

Thanks!

[Pbase]

Reading a lot of the questions, it sounds like maybe there needs to be some clarification as to why you would use this feature and what problem the TR team felt they were solving or what benefit this provides. Maybe it’s a stepping stone to a future feature? I’m sure it was done for good reason(s) and will add value to many users, but it isn’t fully clear to some.

[giventotri]

I don’t want to speak for the TR team, but the value I see is that it reduces some of the calendar maintenance I’d have to do otherwise, e.g. if I know I’m going on a solo unstructured ride every Saturday, then I can block those days off in my plan so TR doesn’t schedule workouts then, and then I don’t have to deal with unmatching the ride from the workout, deleting the workout, having to accept/reject adaptations since I didn’t do the scheduled workout, etc. It’s a small quality of life thing akin to being able to block out vacation days in the plan.

[JoeX]

I think it’s a plan builder thing, when you’re deciding which days for what, more than a general calendar improvement. But I’m not sure. So maybe instead of low volume plus your club/commute rides as you might traditionally, you pick high volume and select your club/commute ride days?

[mvilanova]

Thanks @eddie, names are being exported correctly, but TSS still not. Sorry if the team is still working on it and we’re being too impatient

[ming]

@tim_nh @mattyman The goal was to streamline the scheduling process at this step, particularly for new athletes. After talking with our Support team about how athletes use phase adjustments and looking into the usage, I felt this was the right move. It also sets us up for significant improvements to Plan Builder and Adaptive Training in the future.

That said, I’d love to hear more about how you’ve used individual phase adjustments. I’ve DM’d both of you to get your perspectives! Thanks!

[ming]

@jmkizer

I have been using a Low Volume plan and doing all three rides during the week and then adding a group ride and a solo gravel ride on weekends.

With this change, I should move to a Mid Volume plan with the two weekend rides a a part of the plan.

Yeah, this is definitely a use case where you could bump up the plan volume and build your additional rides right into the plan! I would set it up to be 2 hard interval workouts and 1 easy workout during the week. Then replace one of the hard intervals during the weekend with the Group Ride, and the endurance ride with the gravel Solo Ride.

[ming]

@AndrewBl

Designating rides as solo or group rides, or anything for that matter…why would I do this? I feel like I’m missing an important use of T.R.

@Pbase

it sounds like maybe there needs to be some clarification as to why you would use this feature and what problem the TR team felt they were solving or what benefit this provides

One of the most common questions we get from athletes is how to incorporate their unstructured ride into their training plan. In the past, we recommended manual workarounds. I think these workarounds added complexity/confusion. And I’ve personally felt “locked in” to a training plan before – like I couldn’t stray from it (I don’t think this is unique to me).

Having this ability at the planning step removes that complexity. And with Red Light Green Light, we can catch excessive fatigue early even if those rides do tip into being unproductive.

And it does unlock more improvements and iterations on our roadmap.

@AndrewBl

My occasional runs and twice weekly strength training aren’t factored in

If you haven’t already, it sounds like you would really benefit from enabling New Sport Types in Early Access! There’s more info in this thread: 🎉 🏊 🎉 NEW Early Access Feature: New Sport Types Supported by Activity Sync 🎉 🏊 🎉

[ming]

@mvilanova

names are being exported correctly, but TSS still not

We’ll have a look, thanks for bringing this up!

[john_dc]

This is what I have done, gone from LV to MV as that was what I was doing and trying to incorporate indoor TR sessions. Now its laid out more logically and can see that the outside rides have a designated effort and have a better fit with the indoor specific workouts.

[Caro.Gomez-Villafane]

[jmkizer]

One more plan setup clarification, the times are still the maximum time that you have available, right? I mean, if I say a four hour group ride that means up to four hours? Or if I say I have 90 minutes available on Thursday morning, that’s up to 90 minutes?

It looks like the training plan doesn’t adjust the group/solo ride durations.

That’s a little disappointing because if I am preparing for a 4.5 or 5 hour ride, I like to increase the time on the bike leading up to the event. Even though it’s a group ride, I can choose to ride to the ride, etc.

[Sundance]

I think this is the type of a feature that may benefit my riding schedule (although I think there is a caveat) but it’s definitely a step in the right direction for those that weave unstructured group rides into their week. I’ve read through the replies but can’t see an exact answer for my issue.

I ride 4 times per week. My typical schedule is:

Monday - TR (hard intervals)
Tues - Strength training ( Dialed Health program)
Wednesday - Group Ride (3 hrs)
Thursday - TR ( hard intervals)
Friday - Strength training (Dialed Health)
Saturday - Group Ride (3-5 hrs depending on stage of training and weather)
Sunday - Rest

Of course, days sometimes move around due to life and weather although one group ride will always be on a weekend and the other is mid week.

I’ve typically ignored the TR Saturday workout and just done the group ride instead (unless the ride is called off due to bad weather).

So, in theory this new feature should help me as I can get the group rides as part of the plan builder schedule and AT can work this into its magic.

HOWEVER, as I ride 4 times per week there doesn’t seem to be an option that is optimised for me.

I usually chose LV and just do an additional Wednesday group ride which isn’t part of plan builder (but is being considered by RLGL).

What’s the best way of getting my 4 ride schedule into my plan?

As I see it my options are

a) use LV, add the Saturday group ride but always manually add Wednesday Group ride or just do it and allow activity synch to record it

b) choose MV where I can add both Group Rides but I will always have to delete a scheduled TR ride.

Finally, I always schedule the 2 hard TR workouts during the week to prioritise them. The weekend TR endurance work out is effectively replaced by a group ride.

However, I can’t control how hard the group rides are. IF is typically in the 0.65 to 0.72 range depending on terrain so not sure whether I count these group rides as ‘Hard’ or ‘Endurance’

There doesn’t seem to be the flexibility to record both group rides as ‘Hard’ or both as ’ Endurance’ if you also have 2 TR Hard workouts scheduled. Is that correct? Maybe that’s deliberate to avoid overtraining?

Would be grateful for any insights on how to best optimise for my situation!

Many thanks for any feedback!

[jmkizer]

Are there any plans to make the group and solo rides adaptive? It seems logical that if you have an adaptive training plan, all the rides should adapt accordingly.

Given that the rides don’t currently update, what would be the advantage of switching from a low -volume plan with two additional rides to a mid-volume plan that includes one group ride and one solo ride?

[Caro.Gomez-Villafane]

Hey @Sundance

I think the best course of action in your case scenario would be a) use LV, add the Saturday group ride but always manually add Wednesday Group ride or just do it and allow activity synch to record it

One, because it sounds like your Saturday group rides would be more fixed than the Wednesday one, and two because it’s better to add in an unstructured ride than delete a scheduled TR Workout.

The Wednesday group ride not being part of Plan Builder just means that the ride won’t be adapted to an easier ride or a Rest Day like the Saturday Group Ride will, so if on that day you have a Yellow or Red Day you’ll have to make a conscious decision to go on the ride and try to keep things easy or not riding at all. Other than that, as you said, it will still be considered by RLGL and affect subsequent scheduled workouts.

As far as the group ride effort goes, they are definitely going to vary, however, we’ll give you a recommendation as to how to tackle it on that day. Examples:

[carytb]

Hi Three questions please

1. After doing a planned grouped wise do you have to a. rate the RPE and b, associate the ride you’ve done with the group ride.
2. I’ve put a group ride for every Friday and this week its going to be on a Thursday what is the best way of dealing with this? For this week I’ve gone into the Plan phase and moved the workouts round to accommodate it. Is it that correct?

[Sundance]

Hey @Caro.Gomez-Villafane

Many thanks for your reply. The Wednesday ride is just as fixed as the Saturday. Only weather may change the day. Just wondering whether that would that change your advice to opt for MV and delete the easy ride each week or is it still better to go LV and manually add the second outdoor ride?

One other quick question regarding outdoor rides. I appreciate many factors influence how ‘hard’ a ride is but what would you say is the IF range that would determine an easy, endurance and hard ride?

Many thanks for your feedback

[Caro.Gomez-Villafane]

Welcome!

Personally, I like to add rather than delete a ride from the plan. But since it would be an Easy Endurance ride you’d be skipping and doing strength training instead, you could totally go Mid Volume. The idea is to try and preserve the workouts that drive fitness adaptations, which tend to be interval workouts, so you’d be good to go.

It would look something like this:

As far as gauging rides by IF you could use these ranges:

Easy Ride: Recovery or light endurance rides. These are low-intensity rides meant to facilitate recovery, improve aerobic base, or just enjoy a relaxed ride.

• IF Range: 0.55 - 0.69

Endurance Ride: These rides are typically longer in duration and are done at a moderate intensity that can be sustained for several hours. They help build aerobic capacity and endurance.

• IF Range: 0.70 - 0.75

Hard Ride: Higher intensity efforts, including tempo rides, threshold workouts, and interval training. These rides include efforts at or above FTP, aimed at improving specific fitness aspects like lactate threshold, VO2 max, and power.

• IF Range: 0.76 - 1.00+

[Caro.Gomez-Villafane]

Hey @carytb

1. Yup! Rate how the ride felt and associate it with the Group Ride.
2. Since you’re just moving things around for that week, you can drag and drop the Group Ride from Friday to Thursday. No need to change the entire phase

Note: Edits from the phase may happen if you are trying to make a Group Ride a TR Indoor workout and vice versa, as that option is unavailable through the workout thumbnail as of right now.

[Hugoyave]

Hello,

I wonder why TR is able to say this activity looks like treshold 4.5 but doesn’t increase the levels? Thanks