Seriously. Zone 2 is 200 for me. Heck I’m looking to ride lower than that to keep things easy haha.
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That’s because they don’t. In fact, part of the reason they suggest not dieting on the bike is that that leads to overcompensating. That at least was Amber’s gist, and I believe she started the “don’t diet on the bike” stuff.
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100% I can’t ever recall her saying don’t diet off the bike, but she said over the course of many podcasts Do Not Diet On the Bike
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I think many times the advice from the podcast is very power focused and avoids the weight loss side a bit for (at least) 3 reasons:
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They are a training platform, so weight loss is out of their coaching control and purview. And they may risk some sort of liability if someone takes any weight loss advice too far.
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When most higher level athletes (especially cyclists) hear the phrase ‘weight loss’ they immediately think of the 165lb guy trying to diet down to 160 to get to ‘race weight’. In that case they might actually be better off training their power and focusing on eating healthy instead of trying to find that line of too light. This is a very different scenario than someone trying to go from 250 to 185.
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The hosts all have pretty healthy habits. So the advice to not worry about the food is exactly what gets some people in trouble in the first place. Some people’s “don’t worry about it” meal is a salad, chicken breast, and some spanish rice. While for others it’s mozzarella sticks, a double cheeseburger, fries, a soda, and ice cream.
I would just be careful about taking this too far. It may be an obvious place to cut from but as you ride more, longer, and harder that’s exactly where you’ll need those calories and you’d probably be better off taking those calories off other meals and keeping those on the bike calories.
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I don’t think this is ever what they’ve said. They always recommend eating high-quality foods, and even if you’re eating the best mozzarella sticks money can buy, it’s not what the TR crew has ever talked about.
My interpretation of their discussions about weight loss and the comments that edge towards “don’t worry about it” are more about not trying to force your body to be something its not. If you’re a rider with good eating and training habits who sort of naturally weighs in around 90kg, maybe don’t focus on losing weight to be a climber. When Amber was on, the show kept cautioning against trying to cut weight to get to an “ideal” body or body composition. The point that was made, again and again, is that there is no single ideal body type. Anyone can train sustained power and get better at climbing, but for a lot of people, trying to lose weight to be a “good” climber is going to put you in a hole. At some point, you may lose power because you’re not fueling enough; you’re going to have better W/kg at a higher weight.
I do sometimes wish they’d focus on weight less, but overall, I feel like they’re really trying to strike the right balance.
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I dont disagree…I think you’re right. That said - I still dont like it.
2 things.
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I would be surprised if they have made it known they are explicitly talking about different natural body types, vs dropping clearly excess body fat. For whatever reason, they are being vague about it.
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They DO spend significant time on this, yet do not actually give any real insight on weight loss. Whenever this topic comes up…well see #1 above. we get what I perceive as unhelpful vague statements that dont seem to come from the viewpoint of getting to raceweight or leaning up if necessary.
I generally agree with the conventional wisdom of dropping weight during base by burning it off with a ton of Z2 work, but that doesn’t get me too far. I’m always feeling a bit “squishy” after focusing on just base work. My personal experience is that adding some intensity actually helps me shed weight more than riding pure endurance. I’m not sure if that’s just a timing thing (my diet is probably cleaning up a bit at that time in the season when I’m adding intensity), but that’s what I typically see (n=1). As a 50+ athlete, it just seems to take a bit of threshold and v02max work to get lean and strong. Those 2 things always move together for me, I always have my highest FTP when I’m at my leanest.
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Just a quick side note that the idea that skinny people can’t give good weight loss advice is just as much a sweeping generalization as is the idea that overweight people don’t know how to eat healthy and control calories.
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I feel that weight topics aren’t well discussed for people that are actually overweight and are looking to reduce weight while improving fitness.
I’ve been cycling for around 18 months and started at 170cm and 105kg - ie. VERY overweight.
It was fairly quick and easy, without even trying to drop to around the 88kg mark but I plateaued there for a long time. I tried everything - fasting, not fuelling rides, lots of Z2, changing the composition of what I was eating and not a lot worked.
My “winning formula” in the end was two parts;
- Consistent training on trainer road
- Run in a NET calorie deficit of around 300-400 while increasing protein, but always fuel rides properly.
That means eating around 1700 cals on a day where I do nothing, if I go for a walk and burn 100 cals - I eat 1800. If I burn 3000 on a 5 hour ride, I eat 4700 (including ride fuel).
I tend to look at these at a weekly perspective rather than daily and I’ve consistently dropped 0.5kg per week like this. I’m now at 84 and continuing to drop.
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Awesome work! 
I’d argue that just the opposite is true…the skinny people are the ones that have figured things out. Just like a guy that can’t hit a free throw is probably not the ideal person to be a shooting coach.
I think it’s if’s a bit of a fallacy when people think because someone is skinny, it’s just luck or genetics. I call BS. I’m certainly not what I would call skinny, but certainly compared to the average US person I am. I get comments from friends and family…say when work brings in cookies or something, or we’re out at dinner and I order roast chicken instead of steak…basically “oh you dont need to worry about a thing.”
I mean…how the heck do you think people get and stay in shape? If’s not genetics…it takes years of attention and consistency…
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I disagree - I think it might be more helpful to talk to someone that has lost weight if that is what you are trying to do than to talk to someone who has always been thin.
That being said if someone simply telling you what you needed to do to lose weight worked then no one would be overweight.
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Well…this is sort of what I was getting at. Just because someone IS thin does not mean they’ve always been thin.
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If you want less responsible messaging about food and dieting from the podcast just go back to the early episodes. You can listen to three athletes with relatively low body fat talk about going to bed hungry as a working strategy for weight loss.
It’s probably best to remember that this podcast isn’t only for you and people that are just like you.
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I think anything weight loss is very n=1, despite some people having pseudo religious beliefs in different methods of achieving a calorie deficit (which ultimately science says you require to lose weight).
The main messaging I take from the podcast is don’t diet on the bike. Outside of races/ events, I’m not sure I totally concur with their messaging of fuelling to all the expected work, but I definitely have better results when I at least fuel some of it.
But at least here in Ireland, pure watts generally beats w/kg in most racing!
I think there was some running talk about EPOC being a factor as well and doing two 1 hour workouts a day (one hard, one easy-ish) was a way to build EPOC and have the body do more internal recover work as a result. Issue here is the Hard/Easy, because we’re already tearing things down with the hard, and then the 2nd workout needs to induce stress, but not nearly as much.
I think this is a gross exaggeration of what has been advocated in the TR podcasts.
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What you think or believe doesn’t change the science. The above has been proven wrong across countless clinical studies.
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Hmm. I just want to make sure we’re on the same page…because looking at my quote there I’m realizing it is not exaxtly clear what I mean.
I dont mean it doesnt matter for exercise performance…that does matter. I meant specificallh for weight loss, I dont believe it matters whether calories burned come from fat, glycogen, carbs…alcohol…whatever. It’s all a calorie that is used. Ie…you burn 500 calories of glycogen…that’s 500 calories that needs to be replaced, and wont be deposited as fat later.
I’m just picturing people in the gym looking at an exercise bike with the “fat burning heartrate zone” and thinking that’s where they need to be to lose weight.
I’d argue that going to bed hungry is solid advice in most situations. I’m not talking starving or skipping a solid dinner, but being a little hungry at bed time isn’t a bad thing. Late night snacking is about the worst behavior you can follow as far as fueling and body comp strategy (and studies show that eating close to bed time affects sleep negatively). It’s an easy habit to get into because it can be many hours after dinner before we sleep. A little extra protein at dinner can often help prevent the late night munchie urges.
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