Masters guy thinking Planbuilder is too many hard days (who recommends 3/week?)

I’m in the same boat.
I followed fascat plans, and found that i could much more easily cope with the high TSS on their plan than similar TSS on a MV plan on TR.
With the imminent advent of AT, and having had a bout of Covid, I decided to switch back to TR.
MV is working well for me, with the caveat of swapping the Sunday SS workout with the recommended Z2.
I didn’t do this last week, and I feel like I’m paying the price. It’s been really hard to recover from the back to back SS/Threshold days.

Hence my week looks like this:

Monday: Threshold or Sweetspot
Tuesday: off
Wednesday: Vo2
Thursday: short endurance
Friday: Threshold
Saturday: off
Sunday: Long z2


How do you alter your calendar plan to do 2:1 work and recovery. I tired messing manually and screwed up the taper going into the week of Wilmington (Jun 5)

Now I’ve deleted that plan hoping to just hit PB and thought it’d have me do specialty for the next month but it started with a month of base and one week of Spec. going into the race.

Getting great confirmation from everyone on this post that my thoughts on the weekly structure are being done by others in our age range!! Thanks everyone.

sounds good!


I like the sounds of this. Thanks fellow Michigander.

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Build or Specialty:

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why not just do the polarized plan?

Which structured plans?

Some people prefer to retain the (mostly) pyramidal structure coming from TR rather than jumping into POL.


I looked at POL but the intensity of the WOs was less than what I’ve been doing for the past month. I just loaded a low vol plan to see what it looked like and it looks perfect (like polarized basically) if I add Z2 to weds and Sunday for my schedule.

Private coached for the first 5 years (very CTS like), Then some self coached like the private plans, then generic plans-- not unlike TR, but less personalized like TR is. Then TR for the past 3 years.

Are you planning to train mostly indoors? How would you compare the plans? Don’t under estimate motivation to train, which can be impacted by the plan. I’m not sure how a generic plan can be less personalized than TR.

I’m motivated. I typically burn out by fall though so I’m trying to continue working as hard as I can without digging the normal hole by fall. I train outside other than December-February or so in Michigan here

Burning out by fall is not uncommon . If it works in your schedule try to take it break/week completely off mid season. For me after the Lumberjack 100 (finishing Specialty) in late June I’m taking a week off of no rides before a re-build and Specialty to finish off the race season. Which now races go through October.

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You might want to email the promoters, I just heard Wilmington Whiteface on June 5th is cancelled. Personally I prefer other plans for doing outside training, because they were designed to be executed outside and they have tips for outside riding. TR’s app for indoor is very appealing however for me at +7 yrs calendar and 6 yr training age the plans required too many modifications. But with your 15 years experience it could be different. My recommendation is to ignore the polarized talk and go straight to the established coaches with masters outdoor plans which in my mind one short list is CTS, FasCat, and Velocious (I have off-the-shelf plans from all 3) although there are many others for example my local fitter has been coaching for ~20 years and written a bunch of PezCycling articles.

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You’re kidding!! I thought since NY was opening up, it was going to be a good sign for the race…

Let’s hope it doesn’t get canceled. Sent you a PM with info, reading again it was info from Whiteface and hasn’t been confirmed with race promoters.

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Below is what I do

Monday: Off
Tuesday: VO2
Wednesday: Endurance
Thursday: Endurance
Friday: Threshold
Saturday: Endurance
Sunday: Endurance

Depending on the VO2 and threshold workouts I choose I can make this Polarized or Pyramidal. Typically either Saturday or Sunday is outdoors, longer endurance.

If I’m disciplined on the weekends and doing lower end endurance throughout I can do this almost indefinitely without recovery weeks. If I let the intensity creep up and the TSS gets too high I rotate in recovery weeks every 3 or 4 weeks, depending on how poor my discipline ends up being

For the hard-day workout selection process I like to build a progression for myself that increases duration or intensity over time - that’s how I get progressive overload - but honestly if you just want to do 4x8 over and over you can do that as well :slight_smile:


I think basically what I said in link below. Not going to be helpful as far as what to do about it, but might provide useful insight in direct answer to your question:

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FWIW having done other plans including CTS, and knowing Dylan started coaching with CTS, we could have an interesting debate on that part of your post. Experienced coaches that have a lot of direct feedback from masters athletes, and that are paid on results, design plans that are fundamentally different from TR. While I agree that TR appears to focus on short-term results, that in fact is one my issues with the plans. And once you reach a certain age, IMHO the sheer number of intervals and intensity are a problem. You didn’t bother to include age as a factor in under-recovery. Top coaches seem to agree as well, thats why if they offer off-the-shelf plans they have separate plans for masters athletes.

Short-term results may in fact undermine long-term results. The original time crunched plan from CTS included a LOT more aerobic development versus the current TR plans. For two years I bought into the new fangled time crunched crank up the intensity approach and all I got was slower and brittle fitness. No thanks.