those charts are doodoo
Was your trick 100rpm cadence? That would cause me to blow up
Yeah, I think OP was joking, but wow, we’ve gone in a very…different… direction.
No definitely not a joke. I wouldn’t do that for something as important as ftp. If these so called “advanced analytics” were that important then they would be in the plan. Just adding layers of complexity isn’t going to help.
Follow the plan. Ai ftp goes up. Win races.
If you’re doing 40-70 min efforts at FTP then by definition your FTP is wrong. You shouldn’t be able to do 60+ min at FTP if your FTP is correct. Therefore a re test is the correct suggestion.
Fixed, that is better.
Let’s not get pedantic. The point of the post was to highlight that doing a 70min interval at FTP (even though it is a theoretical value) suggests that his FTP is almost certainly wrong. I’d love to know how many people can hold their genuine FTP for 70min??
Not many, but we know there are some who can. Multiply the small %age of folk who can by the large number of posters in this forum and I’m sure one or two would be expected.
Edited to add:
I’m definitely not one of them.
FTP is a goofy metric. In this case, a rising tide doesn’t float all boats. There are so many assumptions built into “Just raise your FTP and everything gets easier,” it is difficult to even discuss. It’s just nonsense, and it’s not how people train at high levels. Progression level domains are a much more useful metric for how you will perform in a race.
This thread has been simultaneously painful to read but somewhat entertaining at the same time.
It is not being, it about correcting a misrepresented quote that later focused on a single number when a range was given.
It was “40-70 minutes” which was a fair comment that most would agree with. Nothing to suggest an incorrect FTP.
Intervals or period of time at FTP in this time range is perfect reasonale for anyone except those that have an artificially high FTP.
I commented because the reply that doing work at FTP for time periods of **40-**70 minutes means FTP is wrong is clearly an incorrect statement.
The focus suddenly became on the 70 minutes but that was not what was originally dicussed, it was a time range.
I agree. There are plenty of threads where people can poke fun or have a laugh but when you’re trying to make a serious point and you get a childish response.
More than happy to engage in constructive discussion. I for one have learnt a lot from this forum and Ive got plenty to learn.
Fair point about the range. If it had originally been written as 40-60 @ FTP I wouldn’t have raised my points. Rather my response was on the 60-70min part.
My understanding was that FTP is the maximum average power output over 60min. Ignoring the various ways to estimate it (ramp or 20min), I would imagine that the original posters power curve is not flat between 60 and 70min. Therefore one would assume that his 60min power will always be higher than his 70min power.
Even using a ramp or a 20min test. I would imagine it would suggest that the FTP was wrong if I could be held to 70min.
Please correct me if I am wrong on this.
Lesson learnt. I shall read up on recent literature.
In my opinion there are not many people that have a TTE of 60 minutes or over but if they do it doesnt automatically mean their FTP is wrong. I mean it might be but you cant say for certain. Its worth remembering a key but small point, the approximately in the ‘held for approximately 40-70 minute’ definition. Some Pro-Triathletes and cyclists have been reported to have a TTE at FTP of ~80 minutes but I think we are talking about the Elite of the Elite here.
An oldie and a goodie whether you have read it before or not, some general stuff about Ftp plus testing.
And then there is the alternative of Critical Power
General comment, not a reply to the quote. …
Getting back to the subject of SST and high PL levels doesnt it stand to reason that a person with a high TTE at FTP is going to find it relatively easy to bust out some very long SST intervals?
Sure, if you can do 50 mins at 100%, you should also be able to do 50+ mins at 90%. Beyond that though, TTE at threshold probably doesn’t tell us too much about TTE at sweet spot or tempo. If someone wants to extend their TTE at sweet spot, they should train at sweet spot.
I’d also think that the workout in the thread (4x20, I think it’s Galena +3) is not a great TTE workout since the intervals are relatively short and have long recovery periods. Do some 2x40 or 3x30 and then start pushing longer continuous intervals (1x60, 1x80, etc).
The most important metric is place.
does winning matter? idk about that. Having a bigger ftp than your friends is paramount for your group rides.
Dunking on my friends is the foundation of my self worth.