It’s refuelling only when you hit zero. Mostly, it’s slowing down the rate of muscle glycogen depletion so you hopefully don’t reach zero.
Well, the jury on this is still out there …
https://journals.physiology.org/doi/full/10.1152/ajpendo.00376.2015
or this one
or the classic review paper Coggan and Coyle (1991):
concluded
But I’m pretty sure a plane doesn’t do a mid-air refuelling manoeuvre only when it’s completely out of jet fuel, right? And you don’t let the gas tank run down to zero before heading to the pump.
I think the metaphor stands. It’s just supposed to be an easy-to-remember rule of thumb really…
Food (eat up): general meals
Fuel (fill up): what you eat 2-4 hours before workout, or perhaps day before a big event
Refuel (top up): whatever you can digest once you start using glycogen, to stop the tank running empty.
So my approach is centered around my intermittent fasting (20:4) with my window typically falling from 4PM - 8PM.
My workouts are typically around the 3PM and 4PM mark, which includes my Ramp Test. So the way I look at it, my overall FTP is lower because of testing in a fasted state which lines up with my daily workouts that are fasted.
This makes me think (I could be super wrong) that if I were to fuel for a ride with carbs I would potentially have a bit more in my tank.
To be fair if you can only do workouts in a fasted state then I’d say testing in a fasted state isn’t such a bad idea but would recommend doing a 20 minute test as it will probably be a bit more accurate when you’re depleted. If you test fasted then I would fast for all of my workouts otherwise bump your workouts up by like 5% if you fuel for them. BTW the ftp test is gonna suck, good luck!
lol…
Endomorph: 87%
Mesomorph: 13%
Ectomorph: 0%
I think you’re looking at it a little askew. Your core point - that you might have more in your tank if you did a test while fueled is likely true.
However, the fundamental gap is that you’re limiting your training over the long-term. If you fueled differently you would have the bump in performance consistently and would likely see more significant, sustainable, gains.
How do you get ~120 grams carbs in 2 bottles and do you need to have plain water also or does the carb mix work for hydration?
Oh yeah the Ramp Test wasn’t fun but that’s the point right?!
Well that’s only 60g per bottle. So i do roughly half gatorade mix, half maltodextrin.
I go up to about 100g in a bottle though.
~35 gatorade powder, 10g fructose, 55g maltodextrin.
Havent had any need for extra water, no stomach issues or anything. I typically dont do more than 2 bottles though…I’m not really an epic ride kind of guy. I’ll go through those in as little as 2 hours, though in practice I just generally bring the 2 bottles and refill with water after. But generally that’s enough…I rarely will do more than 50 some miles on a fast group ride.
Not sure if anyone has mentioned orzo in this thread, so I thought I’d give it a plug. It’s a semolina product that looks like rice, but it has the starchiness of pasta. It’s great to eat before and after rides. I’ve even eaten it a couple of hrs before cx races w/o any digestion trouble.
I’ve found tailwind works really well for me, for 3 hours hard. After that I’m getting hungry.
Been bringing a lot of haribo on my sweetspot rides outdoors.
5+ gels per ride is just not sustainable.
Do you guys reckon earing sweets like that is considerably worse health wise compared to malto drinks/gels/bars?
I have to admit (n=1), doing long Z2/endurance rides is much easier on a HFLC diet. The physical and mental sensations during such rides are much more even-keeled than on a HCLF diet.
Comparing my summer of HFLC high volume Z2-only training last year with going full-on carbs 4-months ago, and now in my 6th week of 80/20 training…I get many more weird feelings during the final hours of long Z2 rides.
Of course I can also hammer out way more carbed-up VO2max intervals, so I’ll take the trade-off.
nope. Having processed sugary things all bad when not needed, so just use them on the bike to fuel the fire.
The energy “release” might be slightly noticeable between malto-based and sucrose-based energy. Maybe a slightly higher risk of tummy troubles?
As long as you’re not scarfing down bags of Haribo for breakfast, lunch, and dinner…you should be just fine.
I was listening to the podcast and it referred to this thread, I really struggled with the third week of MV Sustained Power for a variety of reasons, but I thought I would give overfuelling a go to see if it helps as week 5, 6 and 7 are a bit daunting. 1.5-2h sessions sweet spot, threshold and vo2 over 110TSS per session.
I use caffeine gels when working out, so Ill be doing 23g every fifteen minutes plus 750ml water per hour…most Ive done before is every 20mins on race simulations.
Then add a recovery drink immediately after, a whey protein Ive been using only occasionally since last year.
Any tips?
Trying to shake down some weight. I am 1.86m and I weigh around 78kg, already lost 2kg. I do mid volume plans, now on SPB. It’s difficult to get all the carbs, but still not feel hungry and reduce intake by 500 kcals. Really struggling. But I used to weigh in the 73-75kg range before I started structured plans in October 2019. For some reason, my body always wants more food, even though I eat low sugar foods off the bike (rice, brown pasta, sweet potato, oatmeal, etc.). I eat around 1900-2000 kcal every day and try to stay there. All high quality food, except sometimes 40 grams of crisps or only 2 beers max (3 times a week).
If you’re losing weight/wanting to lose weight, you should be expect to be hungry, there are no two ways about it. I
I would flip it round and say you should never feel too full. Focusing nutrient dense foods shouldn’t lead to hunger.