Highest FTP this year - but had difficulty keeping up with groups

Training
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This season, despite a very busy spring and summer as I was dealing with closing on a home, my full-time job, and family commitments, I had the highest FTP I’ve ever had in 5 years, 308W (4.1 w/kg)! For reference, in 2020 when COVID hit, I’m sure a lot of us suddenly had a lot of time to train, and I was able to hit 311W as my FTP and felt fast.

I followed TrainerRoad’s FTP increase plan via Plan Builder, which prescribed me General Base 1, 2, 3 → Sustained Power Build → Century Specialty.

This is to say that consistency really paid off. I was training for only 4–6 hours per week, mostly on the trainer, while navigating a busy summer and strength training twice per week. Despite this, my FTP kept increasing. Though I found some sessions quite challenging, especially VO2 max ones (spoiler alert!), I was able to push through them and grow my fitness.

However, I faced a big challenge. I did not find group rides easier, and I think I know why. I may need to change my approach for next season. The Sustained Power Build, Century Specialty, and even the Base phases, I found, did not prepare me for what one would expect in groups: surging and coasting. The surges were, for the most part, 150% of FTP or even higher on hills. I live in Eastern Canada, quite close to Maine, so the terrain includes false flats and rolling hills.

On average, for every 100 km (60 miles) of riding, you would have about 1100m/3,608 ft of elevation to climb, so not so flat.

While I had no issues holding tempo, sweet spot, or even suprathreshold during climbs, I found it very challenging to hold anaerobic power or handle repeated surges. I felt like I was barely hanging on, whereas others with similar or even lower FTPs were able to manage them with much less effort.

The FTP increase plan, while it raised my FTP, did not prepare me for these anaerobic surges and hard gear sprints, and as a result, I kept getting dropped or struggled just to hang on. A few surges at 150% FTP were enough to drop me.

If I recall 2020 correctly, when I had a 311W FTP, I found group rides much easier. I was able to keep up with the local Wednesday night groups and handle the surges. I think it was because I did Short Power Build that year. However, I later did Century Specialty that season, and that’s when the snappiness in my legs dropped.

This was the biggest learning curve for me this season. A higher FTP, which I’m happy about since I was consistent and trusted the process, might not help much in group dynamics.

What’s even harder, as I learned, is that group rides in Zwift are very smooth. You can steadily hold 3.5 or 4.0 w/kg on climbs and keep up with faster groups without needing to surge. But out on the roads, it’s different. Surges are required over and over again, which sustained power plans do not prepare you for.

No wonder I was facing challenges on rolling terrain when trying to keep up with groups!

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  1. Sounds like you might need more anaerobic work.
  2. Maybe counting too much on your FTP not tactics.

I have been number 2 my FTP isn’t as high but I can still hang with tactics. As in sit in the front let it surge drift to the back and hang on to the wheel or just better corners. My 2 cents.

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Are you tracking vo2?

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This sounds predictable.

Most Group Rides are quite peaky in nature and your training was for long steady efforts. So in effect you traded your “snappiness” for better sustained power.

I guess you need to be clear in your own mind what you are training for and pick the appropriate plan/approach.

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Could also just be lack of practice, because you did a lot of riding indoors. Anticipating surges and staying on the wheel, being smooth (and not surging) when closing gaps. Knowing the riders in the group and who’s a good wheel to follow. Knowing the route and saving energy for the hard bits. Zwift is bad for practicing to group ride because you can overlap with other riders without consequence.

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Well I was looking for a higher FTP and I had assumed that it would automatically translate to being a fast rider. I am training for a mix of rolling road races, and ultra endurance events as I am hoping to qualify for Paris Brest Paris.

Definitely! I am struggling to surge to 150% of FTP over and over again for now. Perhaps I might want to do short power or general build next season.

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You mention the average elevation per 100km, but don’t mention how long these group rides are? Are they 100km? Hence the example?

Someone can make real gains off less hours with good structure. I peaked in June this year at 3.99 w/kg, with 10-12+ hr training weeks. Biggest was at 15+ hrs. I did all polarized training so basically Z2+ threshold/vo2max. No tempo or sweet spot. Lots of 5+ hr weekend rides.

I felt great for my 100+ mile gravel races and crushed several goals and PR’s. Felt strong all throughout the range.

I did my last “big” ride in mid July. Have done two? 3 hr rides since. Mostly averaging around 5-7 hrs per week.

A couple weeks ago, voila, back at 3.99 w/kg!!

Am I as strong as I was in June, at the same w/kg? NO. Sure, maybe for a steady hour, maybe for some intervals. Myself in June shape would CRUSH my current fitness in anything over 3 hrs.

My strong opinion, if your goal is strength in long races, you need time on the saddle and there’s no replacement. Doesn’t mean you need 15 hr weeks, but if your goal is strong 5 hr races, I’d be targeting at least 2 4+ hr rides per month. I’m thrilled to keep my peak FTP, but when I start training for racing again after Christmas, I’ll be adding in a lot more long Z2 rides.

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“FTP is the ticket to the dance.”

Meaning, without a good aerobic capacity, your ability to sprint, surge, etc., is going to be fairly meaningless because you’re gonna pop eventually anyway.

Now that you’ve laid a solid foundation, working repeatability is important for the types of rides and groups you’re seeking to stay with, it sounds like.

That said, don’t overtrain it. You can get what you need with 2-6 weeks of focused training on it, then touch it up. Beyond that it’s diminishing returns and you’re better off doing other things. So my advice would be a couple of weeks before group ride “season” kicks off, work some repeatability on specific type efforts - length of surge, power required, etc. Short/shorts are great training, tabatas are good, you can mess around with the efforts.

For example, if surges are frequent but not quite as sharp, you want to do things that become more aerobic but require high power: 30/15s, 40/20s, etc. By the end of a set of 12 of those, you’re sucking wind and getting a strong aerobic stimulus.

If surges are BIG, but there’s more space, you might do things like 1 min repeats with tempo or “rest” in between. Or something like working up to 3 blocks of 4x30s on 2min recovery between.

More TR-specific, I liked the workouts in short power build that had you burst but settle back in at tempo or SST between hard bursts. These were called “VO2max” workouts, but they’re not really VO2max workouts… just that the power zone they predominantly operate in is “zone 5/6” which “we” call “VO2max”. Those are fun, challenging, and beneficial for things like crits and surging group rides.

Lots of fun stuff when you have to train higher power, but again, can’t emphasize enough: time it well, don’t overdo it, and make sure you’re getting plenty of recovery between the workouts.

All of the above said, it probably would take you two or three weeks of doing these group rides to do enough work to be able to hang on. It comes quickly, and it goes quickly.

The other caveat is that if the group is full of guys who are markedly stronger/higher FTP, that may still be why you’re getting dropped: the surges aren’t as hard for them, and when they DO surge, they’re not already pegged where you might be. This is a really common thing I run into with newer racers who get dropped when groups surge and think they need to work on surge power, when the real issue is they’re just already red-lined when they get to the base of the short hill where they get dropped.

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Some part of this you can tweak through training but you are lacking repeatability largely because your volume is too low. 4-6 hours per week is simply not enough.

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Yeah, somehow I missed the hours. Odds are pretty good this is still an aerobic fitness and TTE issue more than anything.