@bnied ah thanks, that would be great.
Keep up the good work - I ended up doing the ramp along with 4 others last night and everything worked well 
A few people hit new all-time PRs so having an audience definitely makes a difference.
Iām sure this has been discussed, and Iāve missed it. But, group do workouts need to be done using a computer? This may sound crazy to some but I donāt use a computer, ever. Actually I donāt even know the log in. And Iām sure itās too old and slow that the process of logging in and actually making the workout happen would take longer then the actual work out. Been wanting to buy a new Mac but ya knowā¦ more bikes first.
Is there any talks of making this an option using a phone or tablet through the app?
Yes. Right now they are perfecting things through the desktop app since they were already rolling out new betas. The mobile app will come next but it might be awhile before they are able to roll out anything.
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Thanks!
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Apologies if this has been covered, but I did a group workout yesterday and there were two issues:
- The audio was very choppy, to the point of unreadable. To repeat that in the style of what we experienced yesterdayā¦
T-e --di- -as -er- --opāy, t- --e poi-- o- --read----
- There was a lot of background noise at the same time, making it even harder to understand each other. We could hear fans, trainers, chains etc.
I understand that 1 is probably an internet speed issue, but we have all used zoom or similar with equal or higher numbers of participants with no issues Hopefully TR are working on compression or something on the back end?
As far as number 2 is concerned, I did a long ride at the weekend using Discord to talk to people and their noise cancellation is so good that people often asked āare you taking a break now?ā because they couldnāt hear any background noise. Looking into it, it seems they use a program called Krisp for noise cancellation which works impressively well. I am personally going to probably download their app and run my mic through it, but the free version is limited to 120 minutes a week. Itād be good if TR could build in/license something similar, or recommend an open source software to achieve similar.
The issues both improved as people left the workout towards the end, and the overall experience was still positive so Iāll definitely give it another go!
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Iāve experienced choppy audio in group workouts too. And then figured out at least one participant was listening to the GW audio on their end with speakers, rather than earphones. Doing that will create lots of bad audio feedback loops, echoes and artifacts for everyone on the call. It will also interfere with any digital noise reduction trying to work.
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Thanks, maybe TR is in fact using some sort of noise cancelling, which is picking up a repeat of the first few milliseconds of someone talking from a second personās mic (having picked it up from their speakers), cancelling it out to prevent a feedback loop, then stopping that once the channel is āclearā, allowing the original speakerās voice to come through for another few millisecondsā¦and repeatā¦making it sound like the person is speaking through a propeller.
The fact this doesnāt occur on discord with the same people and the same setup is interesting, but itās a good start on how to avoid it. Maybe @Bryce or @Nate_Pearson could give some ideas as to whatās going on on the back end, or perhaps a link to group workout best practices (if it exists currently) so we can advise people whatās a no-no?
Standard debug.
- Audio on head phones.
- Mics not on head phones
- Leave video on.
- Turn off all audio.
- 1 person start counting out load
- Turn on audio 1 at a time and see if the problem tracks to one person.
- If stable add 1 person at a time counting out loud
Usually that sort of audio with video is a Wifi thing. If the work out space is high density or high on device count; set wifi 2.4g to a channel width of 20. Set the 5gz to 40 wide. Thereās a lot more to it; but thatās the basics to finding the problem.
Donāt know for sure what the topology for the sharing is; but Iām assuming Host = host/router so if thatās the case if you know who has the best connection or a wired connection have them login in first and be the host.
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Check this out, itās brand new out of NVidia:
Apparently doesnāt need an RTX card, but itās unclear exactly what is and isnāt compatible. System level and shockingly good.
That requires 4-5 people who want to join a group workout to test tech, rather than work out. Iām not sure I could convince people to log on to do that, but Iām sure itās been tested to at least that level before launching, hence asking for feedback from the TR team.
If one person without a headset can join in and ruin the audio for everyone, thatās an interesting bugā¦and if itās a connection speed issue, having a minimum speed for host/participant listed would be handy.
Looks impressive! Seems like it performs better than Krisp, but Krisp is an easier option for everyone (and like I said, the same people with the same setups can talk whilst riding using Discord, which has it built in). It also adds another step in order to have a successful experience, convincing everyone to find and install an aftermarket filter before jumping in the room.
I personally am using a headset so maybe Iāll just jump into a workout without the guys I know that donāt use one and see how it goes!
We donāt have any noise gate or echo cancelation on yet, but thatās coming and that should improve this.
Our new audio/video system should also improve voice due to lower bandwidth requirements.
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great feature. i want to see the group rides show up on strava as riding together (which was mentioned on the podcast recently - hopefully its coming soon)
@Nate_Pearson post-processing like noise gate and echo cancellation will certainly help, but in the world of audio GIGO (garbage in, garbage out) definitely holds true. To that end I suggest strengthening the delivery of audio best practice tips in the GW interface.
While I know you guys have repeated them in forum, blog and podcast mentions, and theyāre also in the text of the GW launch window and the A/V setting window if you look closely enough, Iāve still seen many people missing that information in practice.
We are talking about a particularly challenging audio situation in the end, with:
- Crappy computer mics and associated system software (sometimes including its own version of ambient noise reduction)
- Fan noise
- Trainer noise
- Heavy breathing!
- Signal to noise ratio
e.g. while using the PC mic may help limit fan-caused wind noise, it also puts the signal (our voice) further from the mic which increases relatively the volume of the noise (background fan/trainer sounds)
If itās a question of optimizing at least your setup @alexgold123, Iād be more than happy to jump on a troubleshooting no-workout-group-workout with you 
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Great tool, thanks team. Iāve done 8 group workouts with lads I coach or race against in NW England. I choose the workout to be fit where we are in the plan and keep them under 100 TSS. To overcome audio glitches and disconnects we use Messenger for the audio and it works well. It helps that we have a Messenger group to share the workout code. Anyone having issues can contact me or the others independent of TR. Certainly GW make you try harder and get the best out everytime.
Thanks, I think my end is ok (although I have the option of a separate mic rather than using the webcam one, which is a wild card I havenāt tried) but if I keep having issues Iāll report back and maybe take you up on the offer! I think I know the culprit who wasnāt using a headset, so thereās also the option of not inviting him in order to ādebugā
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Same here; Tech Debug is the day job and anything that moves this stuff forward; happy to schedule time to help people do non riding debugs.
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I agree with all of that!!
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A good one to mention is Yaw angle. no not that one; the position of your laptop. If you are using the laptop mic and can manage it put the laptop in front of you at 2pm instead of 12pm. That will really really reduce the breathing sounds without making it hard to see the screen. If your left side is better then put it at 10pm. If you canāt do that then just rotate it 20% to see if that makes a different. When you talk you punch through the mics gain limiters but it will be more likely to think your breathing is background noise and suppress it.
If you do ALOT of group rides, then Studio foam in the pain cave is another good trick. A box of foam panels is 15$ and since you arenāt using spray adhesive on your race numbers you can use up the bottle to hang it on the wall.
Before
After - Total cost $80 (total over kill; we did it as much for warmth as sound.)
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Wow! Is it a pain cave or a recording studio? 
Nice.