The 3+4 mins at 100/103% were fine. Once I hit 122% I knew this workout was not happening, and it never got better. Managed my way through the first block, lowering intensity by 3% for the last couple minutes, then decided it wasn’t worth trying to absolutely smash myself and still likely not get past the second block. Threshold work should feel achievable, this did not.
My background - FTP was set at 262W following the KM protocol a month ago, a bump from 254W set by AI. AI FTP suggested 268W a few days ago, I opted to stick with 262W and work on increasing TiZ instead. Have completed 6x5m @ 110-112% three times, 4x15m @ 100%+ twice, and 3x 20m @ 95-99% once, all at 262W. Just finished a rest week, with some tempo over the weekend, so I should be well rested. It could have been things like sleep, nutrition, etc., but even on a perfect day this workout is damn hard.
ETA: Hopped onto Zwift after failing the workout for some climbing threshold intervals instead. 4x8m @ 100-102% without a problem.
Agreed on the toughness of the workout as a whole, but worth noting that the issue started on interval 1 of 4, so I think it’s likely a specific issue rather than a general one.
The warm up was 7 mins at threshold I’ve done some shorter interval VO2 work (30/20s, i.e. Telegraph), added 2-3% to it, and completed it. That’s 140% settling to 125% for 20m sets.
It was 4.9, but the last two weeks prior to rest week was threshold work not prescribed by TR. VO2 is 7.9, going off completing Mount Foraker +3 at beginning (right after FTP bump) and end of the 3 week block.
You’re absolutely right, there’s a gap in my ability or how I felt yesterday to be able to complete it successfully. Not sure I’ll be jumping at the opportunity to try again anytime soon, I don’t know it is mentally worthwhile. Considering the mental toll, I’m not sure there’s enough benefit in fighting through this vs. a 6x5 VO2 or 4x15 threshold.
I thought I’d chime in here in case TR staff are following this because I had a similar experience this season, detailed below. The big struggle for me with this workout was getting through the 2-minute block. I think that happened because all my VO2max workouts had been 30/30s, and I didn’t have the stamina for the 2-minute blocks in the VO2max zone.
I had done Warlow (4.7, Hard), then had a FTP bump and ended up sick the next weekend, bailing on Emerson-2 (3.9). Felt good the following week and bumped myself up to Tioga (4.3; Very Hard) to avoid the super long endurance blocks. The week after that was a rest week. After the rest week, my training plan prescribed Robion (5.0), which I knew I could never achieve, so I tried Heng Shan (4.5, All Out, too intense). I got through Heng Shan but had to lower intensity. The following week, adaptive training knocked me down to Creise (3.5, Very Hard), which I did completely, but barely.
I think @Helvellyn has nailed it, here. This is one of those “weird” / extra spicy TR WOs that bridges two zones; it’s not Thresh, it’s Thresh with a VO2 jammed in the middle, after already starting to drain the tank.
I’m at PL 4.9 on VO2, and have been doing 6 x 2 mins @ 120%, and pretty damn strong at SS & Thresh, but this WO would annihilate me. Zero chance. That VO2 would completely drain my anaerobic tank, and I’d be looking for a rest interval next, not more thresh!!
I’ve learned the hard way that the TR WOs are highly sub-categorized. Thresh does NOT always = Thresh…even at the same listed PLs… they can be extremely, extremely different WOs, with demands on entirely different systems / strain level / “system shock value”…LOL
You have to take a close look at what each WO is going to demand, and decide if you are good, or bad, at that type of WO, and scale it… or swap it… accordingly. Just my two… hope it helps!!!
I’m back at the same level I was last year and I’m starting to get these scheduled again.
Struggled through one last week, with just a few back pedals. But still a struggle.
This was a 3.5 Threshold
Interestingly, my VO2 is “quite developed”, having been successful with both short and long intervals. As is my threshold, having been through O/Us (90/110%) and long 95-100% intervals. A part of it I’m sure was how I felt yesterday, how I fueled, or whatever … but even before jumping in, I knew this workout would be a struggle and a miracle to survive. I guess my fear came true Instead of banging my head against a brick wall, I’ll be switching these up for something I can manage to complete with a similar amount of time at threshold.
Riding for 1m @ 120% hurt, but was manageable. As with @megsambit, the 2mins was beginning of the end for me.
I should mention I’m used Elite Suito in ERG mode. I’ve used it since 2019 and definitely find some ERG workouts to be a struggle on it. I didn’t quite feel that was the issue, but I also was focused on not dying.
Don’t be distracted by the anti-ERG brigade. Hard work is hard work. And threshold is hard work. This is “Go Hard!” and hold on territory. I’m one of the few that can hold it for an hour… Inside, and outside, I am crying the whole hour. At no point am I thinking this is easy.
Let’s say I can dead lift 100kg 10 times in a row. If I dead lift 100kg just once, is it easy? No. Its bloody hard.
So no reason to expect threshold intervals of any length to be easy.
I am part of the anti-ERG brigade Long ago I’ve noticed VO2 and to an extent threshold work is made considerably harder by Suito’s ERG mode Not impossible, but definitely harder. I opted for ERG as there’s enough changes in workout’s power requirements that I didn’t want to think about. I don’t think resistance mode would have had much of a difference, I’d probably make it through part of second set and die a fiery death.
As for RPE - I don’t expect threshold to be easy, but threshold workouts should also not be an all-out affair. If they are, either FTP is set too high or the progression is too fast (i.e. jumped into a 3x20m without much prior threshold work). This workout contains 1m @ 122% and 2m @ 115%, far above threshold pace.
Those 1 and 2 min intervals are VO2, 105 - 120% of FTP. The one minute one is actually Anaerobic. The workout as a whole is labelled threshold. I don’t know why, it should be labelled “slow death is coming.”
I’ve done some shorter interval VO2 work (30/20s, i.e. Telegraph), added 2-3% to it, and completed it. That’s 140% settling to 125% for 20m sets.
Not impossible, but definitely harder. I opted for ERG as there’s enough changes in workout’s power requirements that I didn’t want to think about. I don’t think resistance mode would have had much of a difference, I’d probably make it through part of second set and die a fiery death.