Coming Soon: Updated Training Approach 🚵🏻

[gmjohnson77]

Got it, thanks @mcneese.chad !

[huges84]

I’ll point out that Jonathan gave a brief update about the launch in the podcast (or at least he says he did, I haven’t listened yet), see below.

I’m in the beta and will say that they have been fixing multiple bugs a day since they returned from holidays. There’s a few specific ones that I suspect they want fixed before launch. They seem like they shouldn’t take long to address, but that’s just speculation on my part.

@Jonathan

I also give a quick update in this episode on the TrainerRoad AI launch. We have a handful of polish items to take care of before launch that have come up as a result of the recent and significant beta expansions. The team is hard at work on those and as soon as it’s ready, we’ll have it available for everyone!

[SugarRideAdventure]

If you look in the apple store entry, all they ever day is “under the hood improvements”

(scroll down, click on whats new)

TrainerRoad App - App Store

[wik04]

He talked about it. Said they had hoped to have it out by now, but that the beta folks found enough that they wanted to smooth it out first before full release. Makes total sense. The complexity here with the amounts of different ways people use the app (phone/mac/pc/tablet), the zwift integration, etc., there are probably a million little annoying things to work out.

[alfman]

Thanks!

[OatyPedaller]

I’m not sure whether this is just relevant for the new release; I never received fullprogression level benefits for a sweet spot workout despite having completed all the intervals. I did go the toilet during the second rest interval so this no doubt the reason. I did pause the workout on Zwift beforehand though. I rated the workout as very hard. I thought completing the work intervals would be sufficient to get full PL acknowledgment.

[Norry1]

Nope. AI will look at what you actually did - and extending the rest period for whatever reason will make the workout easier.

[OatyPedaller]

Thought so

[kevistraining]

@SugarRideAdventure

they had only just put to beta

The closed beta has been going on for months - but at least a couple of hundred more people were added around Christmas.

As it is the software is perfectly usable in my opinion - but new small things have come to light after having so many people looking at it.

No show stoppers.

If they were Garmin it would be out

[kevistraining]

@mcneese.chad

they refuse to delineate more specifically

Such a bug bear of mine

The line from TR staff is to “not try to crack the code”

However, if you base it on wording you get something like this I posted in the past:

@kevistraining

I’m guessing it would be something like this (borrowed @adiallo ‘s zwift descriptions)

*I have not checked these convertions as I dont do my workouts in zwift….

Zwift		TR
10	work to failure, ie ramp test or sprint at the end of a race	5	Max Effort
9	just held on, didn’t think I would make it	4	Very Hard
8	went into the last couple sets not sure I would make it, but finished with something left in the tank	4	Very Hard
7	finishing was never a doubt but glad it’s over	3	Hard
6	started to get uncomfortable at the end	3	Hard
5	solid effort but will forget about it once I’m off the bike	2	Moderate
4	Could have doubled the workout length and finished	2	Moderate
3	fighting boredom more than fatigue	1	Easy
2	mostly thought about work/errands	1	Easy
1	recovery ride	1	Easy

I dont have the inclination to test any of this though - I do my workouts using TR with ZWIFT running alongside….

[cartsman]

I think that those different perceptions of how hard a workout is are exactly why documenting it isn’t particularly helpful. With an AI model then being consistent as an individual is likely more helpful than trying to get everybody to align. Similar to a human coach, over time you’d expect the AI to learn the difference between the athletes who think that every workout is somewhat hard and will never use the “easy” answer, and those who will doggedly claim they most workouts are easy or moderate and will only reach for the “hard” option when they’ve gone to the well just to finish it.

Basically, don’t overthink it, just go with how you feel and apply the answers consistently for yourself.

[KonaSS]

I have never understood all the hand wringing and worry over the rating. Just answer it with your gut as TR says to do, and move on with your day. I just complete with my first instinct and never ever ever think about it again. I trust that the machine is appropriately weighting the actual completed work and that the survey is likely only nudging recommendations going forward.

[kevistraining]

I totally agree wrt the TR ratings - but if you have athletes using a mix of Zwift and TR to do their workouts then they surely need to be consistent?

[KonaSS]

I guess I still live in the camp of complete the survey on your first instinct and move on. If marking a 6 vs a 7 in Zwift is going to derail your training, there are bigger issues under the hood of TR.

[Pbase]

I agree that “just be consistent” is the idea, but personally, that did not work for me. I tried to “don’t think about it and just put what you think”, but that didn’t work and I felt the old AI never “learned me”. I was never quite sure when it was going to bury me with my next workout and it was going to be my own fault for rating it wrong. I found myself having to say, “don’t use the rating you personally think it should be. Think about whether you want the next workout to be easier, the same, or harder, and then rate it”. This left me wondering if I was leaving gains on the table. I was ready to just give up until the “Chad list” came out and it made everything much easier. I can tell you that reading those descriptions, they do not align with my personal definition of those words. It’s a few years later, and I STILL have to pull it up and look because of this.

Also, I would personally NEVER rate a workout as a 1, so that number is useless and 4 and 5 are so similar that we CONSTANTLY see people posting that they took breaks or lowered the resistance and then did not rate the workout a 5, which makes zero sense to me. If you didn’t complete the workout as it was designed because it was too hard to complete, how could it possibly be less than a 5?!? No one wants to say they “failed”, so they come up with all kinds of mental gymnastics. Having these very very clear definitions resolves all of that and makes the 5 numbers make sense and become usable for me.

tl;dr - “just put whatever you think it is” works for a lot of people, so they can’t understand why it didn’t work for others, but that doesn’t mean that it didn’t create issues for others.

[LacticacidMCB]

@KonaSS

I have never understood all the hand wringing and worry over the rating. Just answer it with your gut as TR says to do, and move on with your day. I

I think it’s different personality types and any system should be designed to work for all of them. A tool I’ve seen for developing counter measures has you look at the various insights profiles and then see how it would help them. Same here, some people like rules, some like data, some just want to move on, and some go by feeling.

[TooManyDogs]

@KonaSS

I trust that the machine is appropriately weighting the actual completed work and that the survey is likely only nudging recommendations going forward.

Yeah I just assume the answers aren. hugely impactful in the overall scheme of things unless you’re answering “All Out” or maybe a scenario where you do some hard threshold workout and mark it as “Easy”.

My opinion might be partially shaped because my coach is usually concerned with how I feel during key workouts or outlier scenarios.

[sk_mtnbikerracer]

On Yesterday’s podcast Jonathan mentioned needing beta testers and to send on the forum if interested. I’m interested and can beta test the new release. Please let me know.

[mcneese.chad]

You need to go here, NEW STUDY for Cyclists | How Pros Actually Train (Not What You Think…) | Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast 566 - #5

[hawkeye1824]

Interested in beta test… Thnx!