This is the exact opposite of what I’ve heard most coaches saying…
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@redlude97 replied first…
VO2max blocks, effective VO2max blocks that actually increase VO2max, don’t typically turn into FTP gains immediately. Often need a recovery period and then some threshold work on top of the VO2max block to see the nice impact. Something like 2-3 months down the road being a good expectation.
You’ll see athletes complete a hard block and expect to set FTP records a week later and be disappointed. Which is not to say the block wasn’t productive nor that some athletes depending on where they are in their training won’t see an immediate impact. As with so much of this stuff, it depends.
@kurt.braeckel recently commented on what he sees with his athletes in one of the VO2max threads if you want to search that out. I thought it was good stuff but couldn’t find it quickly.
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Winter, the season with 61F / 16C sleeping conditions that appears to fuel my biggest gains. As always I’m going for the most volume I can handle, outside. Just bought another thermal jersey… Bring on the cool weather and the Festive 500!
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I’m trying to wrap my head around the use of word like “61*”, “ thermal jersey” and “jacket” used in the same references. 
In all seriousness, I know it is all relative….I saw a group of riders last weekend in San Diego wearing arm & knee warmers, vests and one guy had on a head band over his ears. It was between 65* - 70*. 
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Me too!
The irony of getting excited for ski season and winter riding, in August. Every year, like clockwork.
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Suffice to say I’ve seen it happen right after a VO2 block but more often than not I think 6 weeks is more the norm for the bump to manifest. And I had one guy this last season who got his 30W after 12 weeks of rest/FTP/Over-Under and high power work.
I think only one guy I can recall got a bump in like 2 weeks and he had never done structure, let alone VO2 work, before.
I think some of it has to do with what you do before hand. For example, I’ve seen the fastest bumps from people who are able to extend TTE with extensive “threshold” or sweet spot work beforehand, and don’t see gains in actual FTP from that. Kind of like they’re “stuck”.
For example, I’m doing a block of 60-80 min thresholdish sets at 260 right now to try to get back up in that 290 area following my break. If it works, THEN I’ll do another extensive type block of tempo/SST/threshold stuff (working 260 for longer or 290 for proper FTP sets, hopefully) and see what I get (if anything) before I go crush VO2max again.
FWIW, and this is not intended as a sales pitch, the people I get from TR and Zwift plans are usually pegged on threshold with short TTE and somewhat highly anaerobically trained, so after some extensive work, VO2 work has always (n=4 so far this year) yielded 15-30W in “real” (not ramp test) FTP. Take that FWIW.
When I self coached that same plan in 2020-2021, I went from 280 with 35 min TTE to 290 with 60 TTE to 305 and 40min in about four months.
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Summer and Autumn I’m just riding how I want to. More interested in running. I’ve plugged in a plan but just to structure my week really. Half distance triathlon build, into speciality. Aiming to swim once a week, run three times, lift twice. I’m running harder and longer more often so maybe a half marathon in autumn.
Winter, I usually have my plans for the next year decided and start a TR plan on January 1st. No decisions made yet, it’s been years since I focussed on bike so I might dial back the running and do Sweet Spot Base into General Build.
I’ve done a lot of hard weather winter commuting in the past because I thought I needed it. I don’t think that anymore.
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One thing I really want to add this winter/base is strength training. I used to lift a lot and did power lifting before cycling, but never really stuck to it when I focused on cycling. And now I’m at the point of having no idea how to reintroduce it back into my training. Last winter I bought some equipment because there was just no way I was going to lift at the gym and try to coordinate timing and all that. So I have a barbell, adjustable DBs, a flat bench, and kettlebells. I’m just lost about an actual plan. I know this topic has probably been beaten to death so I apologize in advance. I’m doing a Polarized MV sort of plan right now with 1 VO2 and 1 Threshold, with the plan to go back into 2-3 SweetSpot workouts per week starting around the end of November/early December. Let’s say intensity on Tuesday and Thursday. When should I schedule lifting? Wed/Fri or Wed/Sat? Wed/Fri/Sun? The only days I could do both would be the weekends most likely.
Edit: I could try something like bike intensity Tuesday evening, lift Wednesday AM, bike intensity Thursday evening, lift Friday AM. That would maximize the time from lifting until the next bike intensity day. And because there’s no way I can ride in the mornings before work, but I could probably squeeze in a quick lifting session. Then long endurance Sat/Sun, full off day Monday.
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I’m having rotator cuff issues so haven’t been doing any strength work for a few months, but in the past, I subscribed to Dialed Health after hearing Jonathan talk about Derek so much. He was good about answering very specific questions like this and giving me advice, but at times he is sporadic in his response, so if you reach out, give him time to reply (and maybe even send a follow up).
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What I’ve mostly experienced and what I’ve seen mentioned from various coaches is that a good VO2 block will raise FTP (once well recovered) and then an FTP block will extend TTE.
This season has been bit of a rollercoaster for me. From reaching all time high power numbers during base training to loss of motivation, causing me to basically end my season much too soon. So from now until indoor season starts again I’m just going to enjoy being active. I have 10k run I’m targetting in a couple of months so I’ll run more. Then I’ll do mountain biking for fun, do longer road bike ride if weather permits, and smash the odd intervall when I feel for it using TN.
Learnings from this year I’ll bring into the next:
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Rediscovered my love for cross-country skiing. If we get yet another winter with good conditions I’ll combine the turbo with skiing (but last time I said this we had like 15 minutes of winter
) -
Once again experienced the highs and lows of mountainbike racing. Was extremely ready and exited for my main XCM race this year, but slashed my tire 15 minutes in. So much prep and exitement straight out of the window. For next year I’ll have my goals on the road and simply use the mtb for fun.
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Actually started to enjoy strength training once I had some sort of consitency. Did core and upper body, but I’ll try to implement squats early on the base phase. Combining strength and some periods of TB and Pol training.
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Need to better control my food intake. I eat mostly healty and varied, but simply too much. And with all the “fuel before”, “fuel during”, “fuel after” I gained weight despite training well and being generally active. As a former heavyweight I simply don’t have the appetite control “normal people” have. Will still fuel on the bike as it has helped with complaince and pillaging the fridge after my wo’s, but need to be more in control of my of the bike nutrition
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Running is a flexible and good way of maintaining traning even when “life” gets in the way. I’ll keep doing at least one run a week just to keep the legs going. And do more trail running. Almost as fun as trail riding
Thus, the plan is:
Now-mid october: 2 x run, fun mtb, sunshine rides, TN
TBMVII + strength
PolMV Base + strength
3 weeks with no structure around the holidays - implement skiing
SSBLV + sking and strength
MV plans from April when skiing is over - probably reduce strenght to once per week
Alpenbrevet in late August/early September - stronger, lighter and happier then ever before 
Just my idea based on what you have and your current plan. You don’t say how many days you want to do strength, but it sounds like twice per week. If you’re going to mix it with PB my suggestions would be to do it on your endurance days. I know that it may not be optimal, but I’d probably do it before the endurance sessions if possible preferably with a break in between. Also, give yourself 4 weeks to get used to the workload and allow the DOMS to lessen - that is about what it took for me at 47, but I’ve also been doing strenghth work in the form of F45 training for years. Right now I’m doing 2 workouts/week at a 24 hour fitness with Monday being legs, Tues upper body, and 5 days training Tues vo2, Weds SS, Thurs vo2, Friday end, Sat off, Sun vo2 as it’s my specialty phase.
I’d probably suggest 2 days a weeks of full body workouts - 1st session Deadlifts, Squats (Goblet,Dumbell, Barbell) Single-Arm Bent Over Rows (kettlebell, dumbell), Standing or Seated Shoulder Press, Single arm Farmers Walk 4-5 Sets 8-12 reps.
2nd Session, Kettlebell Swings, Single Leg Kettlebell Deadlifts, DB Lunges any variation, Flat Bench DB press, Renegade Rows KB or DB, Finish up some planks. 4-5 Set 8-12 Reps.
You’ll probably mod the workout or find another routine that you like better, but this hits most of the major muscle groups. Other exercises you can throw in the mix are Bulgarian split squats, DB Step-Ups, Hip Thruster single or double leg, Good Mornings, KB snatch, back lunge to press, etc…
Good luck and get on it. 
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No experience power lifting, rather 30+ year desk jockey that did a lot of alpine skiing in my 20s and 30s. About 10 years ago I had rotator cuff repair and started lifting. Then took up road biking. For my money - kettlebells for the win. Simple & Sinister programming - don’t overthink it. Warmup with goblet squats, hip bridges, haloes, then 100 swings and get-ups. Thats conditioning. Mix in some other lifting. Most evenings I do 10-20 minutes of mobility work after dinner while watching TV with my wife.
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My big endurance days are going to be Sat/Sun due to my schedule. But I also should be able to ride Wednesdays. Would you think Sat/Sun lifting back to back to be ill advised? What about one lift day Wednesday and the other Sat?
I’ve enjoyed the FasCat 10-Week Weight Lifting program the last two years and plan to do it again this winter. They allegedly have a similar plan that doesn’t require access to a gym (leg press, leg extensions, squat rack, etc). I know they’ve moved to a subscription model with their new Optimize app but I’ve heard that plans are still available for one-time purchase through TrainingPeaks. They also started an eight-part podcast series on ending your season and one of the later episodes will focus on weight lifting.
Here’s the link to the plan using gym equipment.
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Definitely get rest between your lifting days so Weds/Sat would be a good solution - also, when lifting, leave a little in the tank so you have some reserves for your training rides, this will be especially true for Saturday.
When I was doing my build before my first A event, I’d always remember that my trainer sessions took priority, so I’d hold back a bit maybe rpe 7 out of 10 which worked out great. I got my strength stimulus and was able to successfully complete endurance sessions afterwards, and intervals the following day.
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I have some kettlebells and have been following dialed health programming for a bit which has been great. I bought S&S book but didn’t get around to starting it. My main concern was the lack of attention to some other areas like chest and such. I know it’s not the point of the program but I always like to round it out. I guess it’s easy enough to add.
How long are your workouts?
I use GOWOD for mobility and do the same exact thing In the evening. Its addicting
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My plan this autumn: maximize the joy of riding my bike!
Last race is the end of August and September / October / November are the best months to ride here so I hope to get outside on my MTB as much as possible. I’ll start with a week off and then slowly build back the volume. Wednesday will be dedicated morning workouts on the trainer due to the work schedule… which will hopefully slow detaining and keep some rust off. Weekends will be for longer rides with friends. The rest I am hoping is full as many dirt days as possible.
December will get back on the horse for the spring MTB season!
For me an “off-season” is key mentally and physically and allows me to grind the rest of the year.
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I’m mixing it up with my own programming, building out a whole body routine. Currently rehabbing an issue with my elbow/thumb, this was last workout after a separate warmup:
- Goblet Squat (Kettlebell)
- Romanian Deadlift (Kettlebells)
- Kettlebell Swing
- Bent Over One Arm Row (Kettlebell)
- Push Up
- Alternating Shoulder Press (Dumbbell)
- Farmers Carry (Kettlebell)
- Supine Weighted Triceps Curl
- Wall Supported Supination Curl
- Step-Out Supination Curl
- Hand Strength
About 50-55 minutes, twice or three times a week. I’ve got 3 programming examples from cycling/tri coaches, so its my own programming built on top of the principles in Simple&Sinister.
If I’m time-crunched I’ll do 15 minutes with some goblet squats to open up, and then practice my swings.
Always feel fantastic after doing my swings. When I take a break from the bike and double down on my kettlebell swings, I’m always able to come back and hammer threshold on Wed night drop rides. In large part because my coach had me work for 3 years on generating power from glutes and hamstrings.
My off-season is coming to an end, since we can ride all year I scale back during the hottest months of the year.
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Turning 52 in November and have seen my biggest gains last three years when I have trained/enjoyed my bike throughout the fall and into early winter. I just hit the maintenance plan in those months and then get back into base starting in new year.
I realize I won’t be making gains forever - aging happens! - but what staying consistent on bike and core/weight work during whole year means I’m always working on being the best version of my fitness self….and that is immensely rewarding. Big thx to TR for offering a platform and community to help make this happen.
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