Workout Levels V2 update? [Unstructured Rides]

I’ve posted data about myself, here is one of a handful of threads where I attempt to summarize:

This pic in particular:

along with power curves:

and if you look at the thread linked above, basically I got faster simply by pushing my average hours/week up to 7-8.

Simply put, I trained harder than TR in the 2-year self coached era and “got fast” and then with TR dropped hours/week and kept most of the intensity (pic above), and got slower. Then with FasCat and a coach, increased hours again and dropped intensity. Nowadays most of my training is endurance/conditiioning with some intervals. And the intervals I do now are not focused on repeatability and fixed to some % FTP in erg. Instead, like my self-coached days my intervals are done outside and a good percentage of them are designed to push myself near limits (see my Colby Pearce Interview thread and podcast for that coaching approach).

Thats me. IMHO you need to figure out who you are as an athlete and train to your strengths/weaknesses.

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Yea that’s my fairly uncertain anecdotal conclusion as well. I seem to get larger gains when doing 8-10hrs a week of majority unstructured rides during the summer, vs following the ~6 hr mid volume TR plan to the T over winter.

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Its definitely individual, although at a high-level and in general, volume drives fitness. Where the crossover is, well again its individual and depends on a lot of things, such as:

  • training age
  • genetics
  • off-the-bike stress
  • ability to recover


So of course you see people use the TrainerRoad approach and achieve excellent results.

I clearly need a lot more aerobic endurance and conditioning work, in order to do the really hard work. And small doses of really hard work seem to have a big impact on driving my fitness gains, along with the slow&steady gains from doing the ‘easy’ conditioning work.

  • nutrition
  • training history
  • quality of sleep
  • and more

“But I want a simple answer!!”

Sorry…“It depends”.

:man_shrugging:t2: :man_shrugging:t2:


Did you order the code red?!


What’s that you’re saying? Lots of endurance + smaller doses of really hard stuff? Someone should come up with a name for that mix, might even catch on…


You are looking at this the wrong way. Your longer weeks that are mostly unstructured in the summer, followed by more structured training in the winter is in line with traditional periodization and builds upon the other. This is very similar to every high school and collegiate running program around. Following a couple weeks off the summer is all about building up your mileage in the summer (maybe some hill reps/tempo/strides, etc.)… followed by a more structured season in the fall. It is not >< but rather more 1+1.

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Back in the 1970s we called it building and maintaining a strong base of fitness or something like that. Or conditioning work.

Now older, I call it exercising for health and longevity, and the bonus is high performance.

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And FWIW I looked up the origin of the term polarized and it’s a lot older than many think. Here ya go:

:cricket: :cricket: :cricket:


At this point I’m hoping for it to be out by next northern hemisphere spring.


Is the motivation survey working for anyone? I’ve done 2 workouts since the new update and haven’t had 1 pre workout survey…

Nah, I haven’t seen the motivation survey. I also saw it on the notes.

Definitely some cool things coming.

I don’t much care for the notification thing in the top. The added functionality for resuming rides should be great, though I wish there was some sort of delay/check for TR updating to Strava/Garmin Connect after a crash. By the time the app loads (which can take ages after a crash) and then gets through the options to resume, the workout pops up in Strava and I have to go delete


I think this is fairly well handled in Xert. Instead of just assigning a TSS value to each workout (structured or not), Xert will have separate strain scores for Low Intensity, High Intensity and Peak Intensity. The thinking is that the more you strain say the High Intensity system the higher score you will get. If you do an endurance ride the high intensity score will be low.

Xert will also prescribe previous outdoor rides alongside indoor workouts with similar stats. In my case Xert will propose a few times times up a hill (just under 20 min each) on my harder days.

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There are a few improvement points. It will happily suggest that you go for an another 250 XXS ride as soon as you come back from such a ride (same day). And the endurance rides are really anything at TP and below, so don’t expect that you can complete them all.


Anyone know when the new updates are coming? It’s been a while now since they announced anything. I’m keen to get these outside rides analysed!!!


I moved your post under the long running one covering the topic. Read up above to see the prior discussion.

In short, nothing coming other than teasers on the podcast from time to time.


I’d love to do an outdoor workout, and because of terrain, have to extend the rests, and then see that reflected in the difficulty.

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Oh @mcneese.chad, keep the faith! :wink:



Is it happening??!?!??!