I could hold my ftp based from 95% of 20min avg power for about 40mins. No I couldn’t hold it for 60 unless I trained a lot for it. However, I’m pretty sure that kind of training would push my 20min power up a good deal too
If you would like a more accurate and precise assessment of your fitness, look at your PR curve after some time on trainerroad. Those are the facts and not an abstraction or calculation. To your point, I would be very surprised to see anyone’s FTP be equal to their one hour output PR (even though that is one of the ftp definitions).
Unfortunately, power meter training works off of percentage of FTP (whatever that may be) so that is unlikely to change any time soon.
If you notice a sharp drop off at a certain time point in your PR curve or an area that you feel weak in, you can try to find some workouts that work that area. If one were inclined, you could “build out” your PR curve based on the type of event you were prepping for - with the understanding of how VO2max and zone 2 are thought to have outsized benefits across the effort spectrum.
Not sure this is good indicator if it contains data from workouts only. TR usually does not prescribe workouts with max effort 1h intervals. This is for a good reason, you need keep doing your workouts day in, day out. There is simply no point to let single workout possibly ruin following workouts.
I think hardest workout for me has been Velika (2x40min at 98-99%), after which calculated TTE is around ~50min. And even getting this workout was nudged by myself by choosing continuously longer interval alternatives until TR had no choice but prescribe this workout.
This was mentioned in one of the various ISM threads. I think they’d be far better served bringing lactate meters down in price. Even on AliExpress they’re $180 plus strips.
Only when I’m trying to be funny.
Only if you’re ignoring what I have always said, and are training by power, not training with power.
PPP: They are called levels and not zones for a reason.
PPP: The training levels are descriptive, not prescriptive.
But it’s not a misconception, at least not if you insert the word “about” ahead of “one hour”.
I would say that the most common misconception is that FTP is defined as 95% of 20 min power. The biggest misconception/error, however, arises from believing that you can accurately estimate it from even shorter tests (unless you apply a mathematical model to differentiate between sustainable and non-sustainable power).
Although Frank popularized the idea, I am the person responsible for the concept (and the term “sweetspot”).
Note the bolding: to me, it is primarily a concept, but when folks twist my arm I say that it extends from about the level 2/3 border up to FTP. Others are responsible for attempting to define it more narrowly than that (something that I don’t think you can really do, since it is, after all, primarily a concept).
You don’t have to do any formal testing to estimate FTP (cf. deadly sins 1,2,4,6,7, and even 5, if you’re using spontaneous efforts). The question is how accurate your estimate proves/needs to be, and how much effort you had to put into deriving it.
Thanks, but it’s really Wahoo Fitness that deserves boycotting.
What percentage of bicyclist could hold “about” their FTP for a full hour?
Everything I read suggest a low percentage.
But if you can great.
The majority, at least with anything more than a modicum of training. Just don’t overestimate FTP in the first place.
Wait really lol? What the hell is sweet spot supposed to feel like then? Also what the hell zone was I in before I lowered my ftp 25 watts…
Zone 2. 
(and the crowd goes wild!)
Maybe the over-estimating is the difference between us.
Ramp test and AI detection for me.
I’m not willing to do a one hour test.
My first introduction to FTP test many years ago, I hit 245 in a 20 minute test.
Then I could not complete the workouts and had t reduce to 220 at that time.
So I fall back on it’s an estimate that you can trend off of. Just be consistent in whatever method you use.
Ok yea that is roughly what this felt like.
I did 2 x 20’ this morning. The first interval was fine. Last 5 minutes of the second was somewhat less than fun, but I do remember thinking to myself that if I had to, I probably could have turned that second interval into a 40’ one. Certainly would not have wanted to…and it would have been miserable, but I’m pretty sure I could have gotten through it.
I think that’s a very good definition for good days. For bad days it’s…probably just uncomfortable but still very tolerable and possible to get through.
If it feels hard then it is hard.
Oh, I assure you this is not a result of my ego shrinking
No it’s been a very hard learned lesson. I frankly still don’t know how to listen to my body…but my takeaway from a few years of continuous burnout is that TR has no idea what my FTP is, so it’s on me to figure it out. I’m still awful at the whole listening to my body crap, but clearly I seem to better at it than the TR Skynet contraption…
Oh also probably a bit of context helps. These workouts are at 6am 20 minutes after I’m out of bed lol.
A lot of this feels like an accuracy vs precision debate. As long as it’s relatively precise I’ve never cared too much about accuracy aside from getting in the general ballpark; it’s setting a training zone not launching a mars rover or some such.
“Only when he’s trying to be funny” would have been funnier