Tim cusick said that “150%” in this webinar, I am on a break from work, so I have time to find links 
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What are you trying to train?
Continuous threshold without breaks?
@ABG Just scroll up and read this topic. An FTP progression is like
3x10
3x12
2x20
3x15
3x20
2x30
4x20
etc.
You can jumble around the numbers as you like. You progress time in zone week to week.
Have a well tested FTP.
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Also, if people prefer over/unders to steady state threshold intervals, they can and probably should progress those in exactly the same way. 
I have some hard decisions. Unbound 200 but will also be racing some crits prior to the event. Not really sure how to approach this issue
I know I can do a 200 mile ride with crit form as I did it last year with minimal issues on 50ctl. But not sure where I should really be focusing my attention
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You can’t go wrong training threshold for crits and Unbound. It’ll help with both, but I would DEFINITELY have you focusing on longer intervals just below threshold, rather than shorter intervals just above it in terms of threshold/FTP training. That TTE type work will serve you well in crit racing but it’s going to be critical to having a good day at Unbound, IMO.
Anything above threshold for you should be close to maximal, and then the interval structure varies based on what you’re trying to work (VO2? AC? etc.)
I think some of these supra threshold intervals have come about from a misinterpretation of Seiler’s 4x8s. People see some of that stuff and think they should be working at 105% of FTP, but Seiler described threshold in that context as “hour power”, and for most people, FTP < hour power. So the reality is, a quality 4x8 on 2 minute set should be done basically AT FTP, not 5% above it. If your TTE at FTP is no-**** 60min, then we can talk about doing 105% for 30min… That’s just my take on maybe where the genesis of doing 30-40 min of work above threshold has come about lately. I don’t get too wrapped up in the flavor of the month influencer interval stuff. (FWIW I almost never give 4x8 as a threshold set, either. :-).
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Thanks for your feedback. Sounds like I need to lower % of ftp and extend TIZ for my threshold stuff and for my vo2 I need to go high % of ftp for more then 3min.
Recent threshold was 6x8min at 102%
Recent vo2 was 3 sets of 3x3 @ 110%
Make changes to vo2 higher then 120% @ 3min
Threshold 95% and just keep pushing my time there
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Interesting. I’ve seen quite a bit of coaches prescribing this. Even Tim Cuisick is talking in his presentation about “pulling” FTP up!…at 105-107 intervals have to be shorter, so the workout doesn’t become Vo2 max.
I’m not married to any concept, I just like the novelty. Athletica is prescribing this workout every week, along with threshold, 30/30’s, SST, lifting and endurance……hardest cookie cutter program I’ve seen.
One of my key races is a 20 min uphill MTB TT….Im thinking this workout is great for that, later in the year.
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I think it comes down to specificity (“specicifity” in Tim parlance 
). If a 20min hill climb/TT is your goal, obviously working above threshold would be important for you.
I DO give a little bit of work above threshold like this, but it usually comes in the form of over/unders and mostly for people for whom VO2 → threshold work doesn’t elicit gains right away. But I just don’t anchor on it for very long at all. Maybe I am missing something, I do know there are a number of athletes (TTers especially) who do quite a bit at 105 and such.
I would.
How old are you? 9 min at 110% isn’t really going to elicit the changes you’re looking for. Rather than focusing on a higher % of FTP for Vo2max work, I generally give work as “repeatably maximal” and something like 5-7 x 3min… for my older masters guys who are doing a lot of VO2 maintenance work, I’ll do 3x3 or 4x2 as maintenance, but usually target around 4 or 5 min power for that, which is substantially higher than 110%.
It was 3 min at 110% x 3 reps for 3 sets
I am 41
After doing my research from reading on studies and the forum, it appears that TR labels Vo2 workouts that are not a high enough % of FTP. Which now has made me question my whole training plan.
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A big issue with the TR approach to vo2 is, yes, using a percentage, but that’s kind of the problem of having software that many people for erg mode workouts. 3x3x3 is actually getting on the high side of vo2 time for a workout, I believe a lot of people top off at 25min with 5x5, I generally do 18-20mins.
but getting back to the percentage thing, just doing each interval as hard as you can sustain may potentially be a better approach vs either under or overdoing it with a fixed percentage. this is a recent workout I did and set an all time 3min on my first effort at 125% and by the end I was at 110% for the final. so “high enough” really depends, it’s about getting the body to a state vs following a fixed power metric
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That is what I was starting to read this morning while researching the topic.
I think TR will get you to 90% of where you want to go. But I need to be closer to 100% of what I can do.
Time to make some changes to my plan.
Yes, TR uses a nomenclature which has been widely accepted in cycling, but is a complete misnomer. If you’re working in the “VO2max zone”, that does NOT mean you are working VO2max, like at all. Always remember that TR is about selling subscriptions, and doing proper VO2max work is really F-ing HARD. If they threw Spencer +2 at you for several weeks, a lot of people would not like that the same way a lot of people loathe the sustained SST/Threshold work that gets into 20+ min intervals, or riding for more than 90min on the trainer.
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Thats what im starting to understand. Time to buckle down and build my own plan.
Thanks for the feedback, this will be a rough adjustment period.
Reminds me of a discussion with a former PRO that no one does vo2 hard enough as you literally dont want to do them.
This is where I’m at, building my own “blocks”. A lot of good information in the sweet spot progression thread also.
I have 212 workouts that I made as my “favorite” in the TR library, they have 4625!
It takes a few minutes to build a plan but it’s not that hard, it’s surprisingly easy.
The only problem with self coaching is if I’m pushing myself enough. I have been improving all areas of my TTE. So I guess it’s working and haven’t “failed” any workouts.
I have an event in 4 1/2 weeks so I didn’t plan out a whole season. I am already plugging workouts in for after BWR Arizona.
I do 2 hard workouts a week, sometimes I throw ina tempo workout or endurance with sprints. I also give myself 2 options for the hard days. So if I am not feeling it I have choices or just ride zone 2.
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If your doing 2 hard work outs a week are they 2 sweet spot, 2 threshold, 2 vo2 or a mix of both.
Trainer road is giving me the tools, I guess I need to maximize where I want to goal. There product is to get people to be consistent in training. I will be consistent, but I need to move the needle a little more then the average person.
Now I’m in a more of a “specialty” month, so I am doing mixed blocks. The months before I did 2 months of sweet spot only . Progressed out to 100mins time in zone @90% FTP.
Then I did a vo2 block with only vo2 in it and now onto event specific stuff.
@kurt.braeckel wrote this in the sweet spot thread … Endurance + Tempo → SST progression → FTP-> VO2 → FTP or then “event specific” is SST/Tempo and LT1 progression and volume is key along the way.
Thats the general blueprint I’m using to plan out my months.
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@ABG this part has to do with gravel events, not sure if it pertains to your events. Thought I’d throw that out there, event specific could be different for you.
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