Newbie, age 51, started with a Gravel bike in Dec. 2020, added a powermeter in Aug. 2021, and got a real roadbike in Feb. 2022.
Pretty much no sport 2005–2012, significant injury then, physiotherapy plus required work (1/w in the gym and the pool, 5 km run) for the following four years, then started Badminton in a local team (1.5 x 2.5 h weekly avg) in 2016. With Corona that stopped, started some running – and bought the bike because of “hip uncomfort” in Dec…
Currently at 3.8 W/kg (80 kg).
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Are you implying rubbish genetics in = rubbish out
Or rubbish training in = rubbish out?
Neither - rubbish data in = rubbish conclusions out.
The problem with survey data is that the quality of the data that you get is generally very poor. But you have lots of it. When you then start a scientific fishing trip with vast datasets, you come out with what look like statistically very significant results, but actually a lot of it turns out to be spurious correlations (see Spurious Correlations)
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Don’t be sad. I’d love to get to 3.0 Currently stuck somewhere south of that.
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3.8 W/kg @ 80kg are not really newbie numbers. It also means that you can ride solo at speeds of 38-40 km/h outside on flat terrain.
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Totally resonates with me. I’m pretty sure I could do 4.25 w/kg for an hour, which is maybe useful for impressing folk who don’t ride much, but without a wicked sprint, it makes me a really average amateur.
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Yet the numbers of a newbie;-)
As I wrote, not a lot of sport for 15–20 years before, but probably some physiological memory of fairly high-level non-endurance sports activity in the early 1990s…
Sure – depending on bike and wind even 45 km/h – for some (not too long) time…
38-40 km/h is on a regular road bike with no wind on flat terrain, and sustained for say an hour. If that is the level that you are at with little to no training, then I would say keep it up and you can be going places!
Thanks, but, unfortunately, no – my aerodynamics are not (yet?) good enough for this:-o
Hope to demonstrate a >36 km/h solo round-trip for >1 h this year… let’s see if I find a day with good legs and little wind;-)
Same here. Seeing folks get to 3.8x+ within a year of starting to ride crushes my soul every time I read such a comment.
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As my first season of racing (XC) I’m realising more than ever that FTP isn’t everything when it comes to race performance.
At 4.5+ wkg I’m likely one of the fittest in my local club league - the winners are about 4wkg but their skill and knowledge of the trail (most of them have done the league for the past 10 years) - makes it so I can’t even come close to them.
Whilst I have to ride around threshold to not kill myself before the descent so I can focus on the descent and not die… they can push themselves even further and recover on the descent.
This is obviously XC specific but I can imagine it applies to other forms of bike racing.
Sure we can crank out watts on the trainer but what about taking it outside? Or performing after a few hours at tempo. Our ability to recover whilst in a race situation is vital
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WHY?
You should NEVER compare yourself with others and question your ‘worth.’ NEVER.
Just be the best you, you can be, and hopefully that is better than yesterday.
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Isn’t competition about nothing more than comparing oneself with others?
Or should the focus really be on “question your worth”? I mean, my worth is my worth, as a human being, but my “worth” as a cyclist isn’t measured by wins and podiums, or internet FTP discussions. Its measured by what I do to keep the LBS afloat and my advocacy for more and better bike lanes.
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I made the mistake of introducing some friends to TR plus my winter zwift TTT team.
They’re all over 4.5 w/kg now and closing fast on my numbers. Going to have to step it up!!! (Although entering triathlon training focus now when I normally slide back a bit on power output).
Moral of the story, don’t invite anyone to join TR unless you can handle them getting a lot faster!
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From the podcast this week:
-
W/kg Myths, Specialty Training, Ultra-Endurance, and More – Ask a Cycling Coach 364 - YouTube
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Chart Data: Watts per kilogram (bottom values, 0.25 w/kg buckets) for All TR Athletes (all ages & genders)
Additional comments from Nate:
- Middle of the curve is about 3.25 w/kg for Men
- Middle of the curve is about 2.50 or 2.75 w/kg for Women
- The data just for Women is generally about 0.5 w/kg lower than the values for Men (corrected from review to override Nate’s comments that were lacking handy data).
- With respect to aging, the curve drops 0.25 w/kg on average for every 5 years of age after 30.
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Also worth highlighting the original batch of insights
(In the pod, Nate wasn’t sure about the w/kg gender split. It’s more like 0.5 w/kg in these data, not 1.0.)
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Great idea and to that end, for easier access in the future, I went ahead and edited the OP at the very top, to include links to the 3 main posts by Nate, that have the data in various forms.
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I don’t know why not. All the great people throughout history used others to motivate them. Wanting to beat your peers can be a very positive driving force. I see Bob do [a thing] so I will work hard to also do [that thing].
I get that you shouldn’t let it destroy your motivation or crush your soul (if we had them) but I suspect he was using hyperbole for comedic effect. There will be people you cannot compete with so that shouldn’t keep you down. But you should pick achievable goals which probably are benchmarks set by other riders and let that inner drive to exceed his/her performance to motivate you.
In my fit days, all we had was speeds, times, and occasionally head to head club rides or races. I can see that these days you can rely on W/Kg or even just W over time. Yet it’s only by looking at others that you know what is a good W to chase. I would like to get over 3.25, not because that’s a magic number but because others have shown me it’s a respectable target and my own performance tells me it’s possibly achievable.
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Exacty, you have kind of proven my point “All the great people in history have used others” it is okay for the elite, the 0.0001%, they were the best in their feild, for everyone else its a fools demoralising game most of the time (for a massive majority.)
Less than 4 % of people in the UK that cycle compete in competive cycling events, so I cant see how anyone can argue that podiums etc is a measure of worth. (I know you didnt mention competition.)
Be the best you can be,
be inspired by others achievements,
if you must compare yourself, don’t question your achievements relative to others,
maybe question did I do my best, was I the best me…
what could I have done to be better if anything,
Celebrate your commitment 
and work.
Enjoy life and being fit an healthy.
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So at 63 with a 3.49 W/kg ratio I would have had something in the region of > 5W/kg back in my late twenties? Hmm… I know I was fit but I wasn’t that fit!
I’ve never cycled competitively and back then I was a climber rather than a cyclist so it’s a bit apples and oranges.
I just aim to be the best I can be.
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