I’d like to see them put some $$ on each of these features. Like really, what are their costs? I suspect the real costs here are peanuts. Fractions of a cent per activity. The most expensive part might actually be the disk storage.
They keep talking about athletes “investing” in Strava… I think that’s disingenuous. If they want to sell me shares in the company, then we can talk about investing. Otherwise, it’s fee-for-service, and one thing I haven’t seen is service-improvement. For years. Maybe this is going to change, but it requires a leap of faith. I also don’t have any interest in paying back their investors (they’ve probably found ways to get payed back already thru kickbacks to affiliated PR firms and preferred dev contractors – that’s why they’re rich already and I’m not). You know what might convince me to support Strava? Getting rid of the investors… subscription fees to buyout the VCs (for cost because they clearly weren’t worth it) and make the platform is subscriber-owned.
People are upset because they actually can’t take their money elsewhere…there is no other service out there that provides what Strava provides. This kind of things happens all the time with both things that are free and things we pay for. Ever pay for HBO and then the show you love is cancelled? No big deal, you just cancel your subscription and go watch Netflix…you don’t think twice about it. But here, deep down, you know you have no other options and you have not come to terms with the fact that while you are mad at Strava, you will ultimately need to pay for it because you love it…you need it. If this wasn’t true, you wouldn’t be here venting about it…you would have just moved on because you are actually already adapted to this sort of thing.
At least with the leaderboards you have the option of continuing to use the feature by paying. I used to sync my Wahoo Tickr to my Strava iPhone apps on runs. They simply just removed that feature with no warning…there’s no amount I can pay to get it back. Now that sucks!
Their main issue isn’t cost, it’s revenue (lack thereof). They have a feature set people like, but most don’t see enough value in to shell out cash for.
As for buying out VCs - the trend is to let losers run. Don’t add extra cash, don’t sell, just let it run, to either death or a miraculous turn-around. Better to risk losing everything and have a small chance of a miracle, than getting 10 cents on your (already written-off) dollar and lose that small chance.
It sounds to me like the case you’re making is actually the VCs are the problem. Strava the org doesn’t have what it takes to serve 2 masters here. I like Strava… I’d like to see it stick around, but it’s clear the VCs have not helped them. It’s also clear this is not a growth-industry. The trend may be to let it ride, but that doesn’t make it a smart decision.
edit: meant to say strava doesn’t have what it takes to make users and VCs happy in 2nd sentence… I fixed it
Thank you for the suggestion. I’m happy to report that the problem was easily solved by using a different app (my Garmin Fenix 5 has really terrible GPS accuracy).
No, I wasn’t making the point that the VCs are the problem, just that the range of exit strategies they envision is quite narrow: it’s either make a pile of cash or lose a pile of cash, not much in between. As for whether this is smart, on a macro level it probably is, on a case-by-case basis, well, you’re dealing with a beast that provides money, you have to expect they’ll play by their rules when things don’t go as planned.
Trailforks and MTB Project are both good for what you’re looking for. Which one is better will probably depend on where you live, as some areas are better covered by one app versus the other.
See my post up a bit. I think cost here is the primary motivation. Their database back end, called Snowflake, comes with a per query cost. Every time a non-paying user queries the leader board it costs them money.
I think a pitifully small amount of users will switch to paying because of this change. It will certainly not be enough to make them hugely profitable but maybe reducing the data costs and getting a getting a few more subscriptions will move the line towards break even.
You just wonder what the hell they are doing over in corporate Strava. 225 employees and they have taken $42M in VC money and still aren’t profitable after all these years.
Maybe a success strategy would be getting rid of 125 of those employees, making free Strava very limited (like post a ride and that it’s), and then make the paid account $1/mo. I think everybody I know would pay $12/year. I don’t think anyone I know will pay the $60/year just to get the leader boards or routing back.
I just broke down and did the 60 day free trial and $60/year after. Spent some time reading this thread and all the stuff on reddit and thinking about both sides, and while I have similar gripes over all the missed opportunities strava has and falling behind in terms of training metrics and whatnot…the fact is that I store all my ride/run/swim data there, pictures for almost every activity, I use it as training motivation to go for segments, think about my potential on segments that might be a bit out of reach, and compare my segment efforts over months/years. I’ve made plenty of riding friends through strava, stalked activities of attractive women, I use it multiple times a day from uploading my own stuff to following friends, family and professional athletes around the globe, to getting ideas for local rides to do, and rides in new locations…and I’ve done that for 5+ years for free with pretty minimal advertising exposure. I spend $140 (or whatever it is) a year on TR, $25/m for gym membership (that’s been closed for 2+ months), I’ve paid almost 1k + expenses to race ONE ironman, I spend $100/race + expenses for a dozen other races throughout the year, I spend thousands on bike related stuff a year and have tens of thousands worth of bikes in my garage, I probably spend $3-5 on extra food/nutrition for every single long ride I do…$5/m isn’t that much to keep all that data and use the full interface without being inundated with ads for more stuff I don’t need.
I really don’t undestand why people are getting upset about this. The changes aren’t that big as far as I can see. I never watch anything but the top 10 leaderboard anyway, I’m not that interested in who’s placed 351 on a certain segment.
There is certainly some validity to this viewpoint…I don’t personally care where I am on a KOM board. Position is relatively meaningless since it is about time. I could be in 2nd place and never have a shot in hell at getting the actual KOM, or conversely be in 216th and have it as a realistic goal.
That said, the one cardinal rule of marketing I learned long ago was not to put my personal behaviors / beliefs on the larger market. For a LOT of people, where they rank is something they do watch closely.
Because people like free? Basically I’m trying to decide if paying to see Leaderboard’s People I’m Following filter is worth it. Thats about all I ever look at beyond top 10 that is now gone. That and my paid VeloViewer is now useless at sorting my own segment performances by power. But I’ve already replaced VeloViewer with WKO5’s smart segments for all the key training routes.
Personally I’m not upset, just trying to figure out if 16 cents a day is reason enough to send $ to Strava again. You know, 16 cents for the daily inspiration thing I mentioned above… but leaves me feeling like Strava is pulling a Catholic guilt trip on me and so my knee jerk reaction is to thumb my nose at Strava. Or listening to the local PBS station beg for money. So I then go to more selfish reasons - I’ve got 36 beers riding on taking a KOM back from a local twenty something. But I don’t need Premium for that. Just need to pull up my rival’s 5 or 6 pages of KOMs and target one.
If nothing else, Strava has clearly succeeded at getting a lot of people talking about Strava.
Thanks. I’m familiar with both of those apps. In looking at a particular trail just now on Trailforks, nobody has ridden it this year and I’m not even sure how to see conditions for a single trail on MTB Project. When I looked on Strava earlier this week, 9 people rode that trail on Sunday alone.
I think this supports the fear some have expressed in this thread of what will happen if people stop using Strava because they have to pay. With a smaller user base, there will be a lot less people on the leaderboards.
Yeah, I think coverage tends to be better in some regions compared to others. For MTB Project, the trail conditions should be listed underneath the elevation profile for the trail, but if people aren’t using the app, then it’s unlikely it’ll get updated, as it relies on user updates. I’ve never really used Strava to see if people have ridden a trail recently to check on its status. MTB Project and Trailforks both have a pretty active user base here, and we’ve got some good trail conditions Facebook groups around here as well, so I’ve never really needed to use Strava for that.
The problem with Strava is quite simply as a business it doesnt understand how to make money. They have lots of data, a niche audience yet they dont know how to turn that into dollars. It really doesnt matter what they move around behind a paywall…they will not survive long term until they figure out how to run a business.
From my own perspective…they dont do anything that wants me to part with my own dollars.
Basically I’m trying to decide if paying to see Leaderboard’s People I’m Following filter is worth it. Thats about all I ever look at beyond top 10 that is now gone. That and my paid VeloViewer is now useless at sorting my own segment performances by power. But I’ve already replaced VeloViewer with WKO5’s smart segments for all the key training routes.
