Hmm. Not sure how much it sucks. Its just life. We all partake in it and make choices. At one time I had a lot going on. Had 12 employees and worked about 16-20 hours a day on another job supporting the company. Then my minority partner and my accountant stole all the customers and I was out of business in 24 hours. I made a choice at that time for my health. Got a normal job where I walk a lot and stay somewhat fit. Its not a bad life at all. I just need to be careful where our money goes. I will have a pension (shitty one lol) and will probably choose to work longer than I need to.
I take steps to make sure I wont get priced outā¦ Or will take as long as it can. I bought a High end Salsa cutthroat last year. I worked about 80 hours a week (not 160 lol. Sorry) for a few months to be able to get it. But it was worth it to me at the time and the project benefitted a lot of people and I created 4 new positions.
Just listened to the episode today about pricing.
I am Canadian. Trainer road costs us about 25% more than US citizens. I am legacy at $99.00 and that is a good deal but it actually costs me $123.75. Thatās my problem and not a TR issue.
I accepted an offer of a set price and an agreement was made when I paid it. It is not my problem that TR wants to get 3 or 4 more dev teams online to grow faster and make more money. Its also not my problem that TR may not be doing enough to get new users on board. Its also not my problem that TR is wanting to accelerate their speed of new features.
However I like the product, love and respect the team and the people behind it even when I get pissed at Nate or he at me. ( I am sure he doesnāt even know who I am lol). I also want to see this team succeed and continue until they get bought out. ( if that happens)
There are people supposedly legacy around $49.99 a year. Not my issue either.
I am not willing to pay for a stripped down version without adaptive training or anything else. The money I have paid over the years has helped pay for the creation of the product as it stands today. The ftp estimate and such are also features I have been paying for. Depending on what āproā features they are working on probably wont be of use to me as I am older and this is for fun.
The problem is how to increase pricing when there are so many different levels that people are paying on a fixed term. Also remember that when Nate put this idea out there many of us went from paying monthly and only for 4-6 months total to paying in advance for a year! That was a large cash infusion to the company at a time that it was obviously needed.
Another person mentioned prime at $99.00 and then $119.00 and then $139.00. I do not know if that would be enough to solve TRās cash wants (these are wants and not needs as the increase in cash flow is WANTED to add more developers).
I could see my yearly subscription going up to a maximum of $139.95-$149.95 with all the features. I see the need for a change in pricing. But I also see a need for honouring the original agreement in some form. I do not think it appropriate to make legacy users pay the same as someone joining the platform today.
I would also like to thank @Nate_Pearson for posting the information about the ātermā in this thread. I had no idea at all. As a person of Indigenous decent whose culture and history continue to be under attack in North America I try to respect all cultures and I have used this term as well. My ignorance is not an excuse and I apologize that I used it!
For the record, this issue was mentioned in this thread a month ago.
And as I said in my reply to that post, this term issue has been mentioned in just about every other thread on pricing where legacy pricing got mentioned with the bad term.
Iām glad to see Nate officially acknowledge and adopt the better term now, in line with what others shared about it here years ago.
I am using AI FTP detector and AT features. Although like many others on the Low Volume plan, I pick this plan so I can add additional outside rides and/or stay on point if I have a busy work week and thatās all I can doā¦ None-the-less this past 2-3 months probably has been one of my most successful 'sticking to the plan" periods on my TR personal training history the last ~10 years.
All in all, my recent FTP detected level I just accepted took me from 254 down 1 watt to 253 (down 0.1%). I am at 3.58 wtt/kg and in build, so no increase? This is not really any different from other years around this time in Spring either. So no remarkable differences in my n of 1 situation using AT for FTP.
Point being - all of the fancy gadgets, app updates, detectors, what have you . . . if you canāt make me faster with it, itās not worth price increase (at least to me). I have said it before, you are going to have to show the legacy users who have been around for a while and whose rates may go up . . . that these technology advances bring added value to justify any further potential price increases.
@Nate_Pearson is there a plan to show published outcomes to see if AT makes a difference? I really think you have to look at a population who have been around a while. New users to training would be pointless. Any new structured plan for new users will work. And maybe the data to look at is not all about FTP growth, but looking at repeatability, able to handle what was once a limiter like āthresholdā better, etc. However, FTP probably needs to be the primary question in a scientific publishable type of paper. Coach Chad cites a lot of papers, time to start putting TR in the race of publishable results,
All great work and love the company/team with the idea to push the science. However, I would like to see published outcomes. Carry-on!
At some point, we all stop getting faster. It can be due to any number of reasonsā¦age, genetics, volume, etc.
I mentioned on another thread re: equipment that using āfasterā as a metric is not the best measuring stick. You also seem to be using FTP as a proxy for āfasterā. My FTP in season probably has not changed more than a few watts for well over a decade. But I am just as strong, if not stronger, than I have ever been. Am I āfasterā? Hell, I donāt knowā¦too many variables come into play for āfasterā.
A big part of my recent āsuccessā has simply been more volume and I didnāt need TR for thatā¦.but TR has helped me address my weaknesses (hello, VO2 Max) and that has helped make me stronger. But again, my FTP hasnāt really changed.
@Power13 Iām not the one who came up with the product built around the slogan . . .āTrainerRoadās slogan Get Faster reflects our one and only mission: to make you a faster cyclist with science-backed training.ā
As to your point about people being unable to get Faster for a variety of reasons. . . thank you, that is my rationale as to why I would be against price increases without proof of improvement to the goal. If TR cannot turnaround and show their recent advancements and enhancements actually make a difference in the population, then there is no point.
BTW - Iām not at all hung up on FTP. If TR wanted to do a study, FTP is merely the most practical testing value that everyone is using and itās somewhat objective. They can certainly use other endpoints in a study . . . . wonderful please, please go at it. I am happy to see how TR would evaluate success in a study!
All I am saying is that I am ready to see some data and proof.
Youāll pay more if TR shows you that someoneā¦else got faster?
Youāre asking for one side of the equation where there are two variables;
(Y)ou X (T)rainerRoad = (F)aster. Why do they need to show āsome data and proofā? It takes two to tangoā¦
If I was TR Iād head right over to your side of the equation (training history). There had better not be one backpedal, no workout alternates, no shifting plans around, no lowering of the workout level just 100% compliance before TR shows itās hand.
You game? (I certainly wouldnāt be, lolā¦I donāt want anyone looking at my stuff!).
Yes I have all bad habits . . . back pedals and all. Feel free to look TR. @Aplcr0331 you are probably correct that the AT intervention doesnāt help riders like me unless everything else is cleaned-up first. Once again thanks for proving my point that I am not sure it would be worth someone like me paying more if rates were to go up.
Nate, if you are reading you may have your answer . . . tiered system might be a good option after all. Maybe a cheap basic plan for a heck of a lot of us might be all we need.
I do in fact like all the new bells and whistles of AT, but I doubt I need them as pointed-out.
BTW why in the world would performance minded folks who use power meters on bicycles, cadence & HR monitors, who upload their data to at least 2 if not more places
want to see outcomes across the broad population of users for this new intervention. What a silly notion I had, please forgive me.
They sent me a replacement flywheel for mine even though I never had issues with the old ones. I was still using my Computrainer until early this year. It really is a solid bit of kit. I still have it lying around if my NEO or KICKR dies.
On topic: if Iām on $12/m from 2017 and ācancelā will I restart at $12/m or the new $20/m pricing?
Iām still on 99$ a month and Iāve always been in the āIād pay more for TRā camp. With the USD being valued so much higher now, my TR cost just went up 30% because of the new exchange rate for my currency. Not sure where I stand anymore.
Why does this start to sound like people are more concerned that other people are paying less than them, not what they themselves are paying? Like envy.
What anyone else is paying doesnāt affect your bank account or make you slower, so donāt worry about it.
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