Been following this thread with interest because I noticed that I very infrequently get to 90% HRmax from the standard TR vo2 sessions.
Did this today having upped my FTP from 280 to 285 yesterday using the new function.
Got 12 mins at or above 90% and it felt ok.
How should I progress from here? Longer intervals, shorter rest, or higher wattage?
hard to tell what those intervals are?
Ideally you want to aim for 20min TiZ. Then go more power if you can.
Coming back to you (from the calculating LT1 thread)…here is my little take and maybe some inspiration for others:
My experiment with little VO2max block before starting into extensive then intensive aerobic phases:
So no overdose of 3 weeks of 3 workouts (maybe even day by day) per week…I leave that to the recovery pros with no life stresss ;).
But 3 weekends with 6 workouts overall…sometimes back to back and with nice progression.
I favor longer intervals over on/offs…as I’m with Kolie and these are more race specific for me (triathlon and gran fondo stuff etc). Nevertheless I start with one on/off (Rattlesnake +1) to get me going into going hard again.
I try to mix ERG and resistance mode. Then adjust intensity as needed to make it a hard workout but not unbearable. Workouts have RPE rating from „8-9“ and higher.
I have a „VO2max for low VLaMax athlete“ workout in there which I like 4x(2min@120%8min@102%) 4min rbi.
And also the 5x5 Bossi intervals which are also pretty matching for this thread here…I would recommend all to try and use these!
Bossi:
5x(30s 100% MAP (~130% FTP), 60s 77% MAP (~108% FTP), 30s 100% MAP (~130% FTP), 60s 77% MAP (~108% FTP), 30s 100% MAP (~130% FTP), 90s 77% MAP (~108% FTP)) 5min rbi
(Would like to add those workouts to the hard start VO2max team but I guess only the owner of the team can do this…or somebody can promote me to admin 
)
Update: Added to team!
Conclusion:
No idea about exact adaptations but I got confident at putting out high power again after base phase with minimal intensity (bike). Was a nice change in stimulus and as I don’t have to rush into some early peak I have time to start aerobic extensive work from February now.
So after that I had 2 weeks with less structure and bit of life stress and just now I have started into aerobic extensive phase with a 3x20 and 2x30 sweet sport workouts and might meet you in the sweet spot thread.
Done. I think you should be able to add workouts now.
They are 4 x 4min, with 4min RBI.
So, from what you say, I need to do 6 reps to get to 20 mins accumulated time at +90% HRMax? (On the basis you spend the first minute of each rep getting there.)
Not seeing them yet? Only seeing 13 wo in that team so far?
No its TiZ for the power. You could try 4x5min next and see how that goes, That is the next natural progression.
Then 5x5, and then just increase power if you still can.
Thanks @DaveWh! 3 Workouts added. You should see these now.
This is outstanding. Love it when folks share their blocks and how it went.
Cheers!
p.s. Joined the Hard Start team and looked at the workouts. Y’all are Mad. But in a good way.
Based on my experience, for a high vlamax athlete (me), I think there are a couple of features to consider adding:
Some short high intensity warmup intervals to blow off some anaerobic contribution
Intervals that decline in intensity as the workout progresses - otherwise the early intervals feel too easy and the later intervals too hard.
I’ll take a crack at this workout in the next week or so and report back on my actual experience. Note: I can already tell it will be too hard, and I’ll likely cut the last interval block.
My Vla max is 0.61 and vo2 61
I’m in week 3 of a 3 per week vo2 max block. I’ve done a mixture of 40/20, 15/15 and longer 4-5 mins intervals.
4 x 6 mins 40/20’s is how I’ve pitched mine.
This week has been hard. I doubt I’ll get 3 vo2 max workouts in.
Will report pre and post results once I’m done.
Both VLaMax related workouts and those descriptions are based on and taken from:
Look at the intensity paragraph.
Podcast is a good listen and the show notes are a good read.
I’ve no idea about my VLaMax…I’d guess I’m around middle to lowish.
I had to lower the intensity for the 2 last intervals on that workout (for high VLaMax).
Whereas the workout for low VLaMax athlete with long intervals seems to suit me well. But I’m not sure if that always equates to better adaptation/performance…or if I should sometimes switch it up and take those not so suitable workouts … (but overall this seems like micro management problems which don’t bother me much cause I need to focus on the basics first (consistency, volume, recovery)).
this is interesting…
After a looooong block of z2 endurance work and 3 months of lots of low cadence z3 mixed in, I think I have a pretty low VLaMax currently. I’m just starting a vo2 block an dits killing me - even dialling down intensity is leading to quickly failing after a couple of 4 min intervals and having to dial down to barely above FTP 
I’m thinking these ‘low VLaMax’ intervals might be a good way to go, as its essentially whats happening to me naturally anyway! I’m just worried that it wont actually lead to enough time close to vo2max when the intensity has been ‘low’ for a while, but will see what happens.
Note that the prescription was just 40/20 without %FTP. So if you do ERG adjust those 133% down as needed. (I just set 133% because I’m a ramp overtester and down adjust my ramp FTP hard to be more in line with 60min power…therefore use higher % for VO2max).
(Maybe I’ll add more info to the workout descriptions the next days)
Looks familiar?
I asked Kolie about those specific 2 VLaMax dependent VO2Max workout prescriptions and here you have his take:
Kolie Moore on the ramp test - #318 by empiricalcycling
I’d be interested to see your HR response to these vs. longer intervals, (e.g. 4x4 min “all-out” VO2max style, for approximately the same working time). In my n=1 case, I can’t imagine I would get anywhere near the same ventilatory rate or HR from 40/20s as I do from the long stuff. I just haven’t found much use for 40/20s and such other than a sharpening workout in peak, but interested to see what others find out here.
E.g. here’s today’s 4x5 hard start/high cadence VO2 workout… by the end of these I can’t possibly breathe any harder, my HR is basically at maximum (179bpm and I’ve only touched 180bpm this season otherwise) and there’s usually lines of spittle involved. Also, the computer auto-pauses (I need to turn that off) because I’m about fall off the bike. I’ve never gotten that same thing from 40/20s, but maybe I’m not doing them long/hard enough…
Hi Kurt,
I have the opposite problem. When doing 40/20 or 15/15 (really good as you are accelerating the trainer every 15s) I can get the HR high and hold high. I use high cadence and tend to do the recovery intervals on the Z2 / z3 border (without thinking about it).
When doing longer intervals I do not accumulate as much time at or above 90%. Maybe 5 mins less total time. I find have to pace a lot more. If I went as hard as you are doing in your intervals above I would not be able to do another rep without a significantly longer recovery.
I’ve been torn during the block between two schools of thought on these. KM all out fast start longer reps or the more sustainable Jem Arnold / Bjorn Kafka model where it doesn’t really matter the exact format just that you get the work done and don’t kill your self.
I did an aerotune test at the start of Jan and have done a specific Vo2 max block with 2 weeks volume, 3 weeks intervals, and will do another 2 weeks volume with one interval session, then re-test.
same here - these micro intervals have never got the same RPE, breathing etc as longer intervals for me. The longer ones take a lot more dialling in for me to avoid going too hard for the first 1 or 2 reps though.
O/T. but I’d love to know more about how you found this and what, if any, use you have found from the results? I’ve heard from others that the Aerotune/INCYD tests are essentially the same algo and have also heard some discredit it. Wondering what your experience and thoughts are - does it produce useable info to infirm your training decisions? Thanks
I’ve used inscyd and helped a few with it for a couple of years. With some good results. But it’s too expensive and I dropped off with it. But aerotune is cheaper and Bjorn Kafka has shared some good advice and info on the various podcasts.
I will share my results after the second test in a few weeks.
One of the main takeaways for me has been seeing the difference in carb use between sprinter and more endurance riders at lower intensities. I’ve really upped CHO intake in zone 2 rides and don’t feel guilty going slower on these rides.
