First Ramp test - trainer issue

[Alan]

Hi Everyone, im listening to the podcast for a while but am very new to indoor training

I done my first ramp this earlier, and had an issue where just as the effort started to bite the trainer resistance seemed to jump drasticaly.
It feels like there was a brake or huge resistance being applied to the rear wheel/drum which made my cadance (90-100) plummet to below 60 and basically ended the ramp test

I felt I had more in the tank had the resistance/cadance been more progressive

I feel like trying the 8 or 20 minute ftp test as the Ramp test was not at all taxing

Any advice on my set-up ?

Gear:
Wahoo Kickr snap
25mm tire - 96.4 psi
ERG mode
Calibration/spin down done ahead of test
Inner chain ring middle of cassette

TR esitmated my FTP to be 136 from a intro ride I done
This is much lower than what I would expect my actual to be (low 200)
Thanks
Alan

[mcneese.chad]

Can you share a link to your test from the workout on the TR site?

Your account will need to be public. If that’s an issue, a decent screen shot is a starting point for review.

[Alan]

Get Faster with TrainerRoad

[CaptainJack]

Do you have a power meter on your bike and was it connected to your computer as well as the Kickr? If so make sure you disconnect the power meter from TR and just have the Kickr connected. If you want the Kickr to go off your power meter then have that connected through the Kicker app only. Maybe you don’t have a power meter but it was worth me giving it a shot.

[mcneese.chad]

His workout shows a Kickr Snap as the other data source, so he doesn’t appear to have a power meter paired.

[mcneese.chad]

I have a couple of observations, based on the file:

1. Your cadence seems quite variable, and has some notable dips well before the final step that you made. Seems you started having trouble about 13 mins in, had a notable hiccup about 15:45 and finally popped around 16:42.

   • Main take away is that you may have had trouble well ahead of the final step, and it’s not a single kick that burned you. Judging from the irregularity of your cadence, I’d say you may have well been spent vs having more juice to offer, but that is a guess.
   • If you have HR data, we might have more to judge the progression and failure.

2. Checking your prior ride to the Ramp, it looks like you had the FTP set at 160w. You finished around 16:42, and got a 136w FTP from this ramp, the “steps” may have been a bit “high” for you.

   • At prior 160w FTP for the test, the 6% step is 10w increase.
   • At your new 136w FTP, a current test would be 8w increase.
   • So, on one hand you could say that you started with too high an FTP and the steps were more “painful” or “impactful” than if you had done a lower starting FTP.
   • However, the reality is that we are talking about a 2w difference, which seems small in the grand scheme of things.

3. You have the default “Enable Power Smoothing in ERG Mode” active. It’s a setting from Wahoo and one I personally hate. Have a look at the following video and consider turning that setting off, to get more accurate looking power data, than the overly smooth and fake data as shown.

   • https://youtu.be/7L7hfT0I7E0

4. What are you using as a basis of your 200+w estimated FTP?

[iamholland]

@Alan

I agree with Chad’s assessment. It looks right to me, FWIW.

@mcneese.chad

What are you using as a basis of your 200+w estimated FTP?

+1

I find most people are shocked when they see their first results.

[mcneese.chad]

Just to add for reference, here is my latest Ramp test from a few weeks ago.

Get Faster with TrainerRoad

• Notice how jumpy the power appears from my Kickr, without ERG smoothing applied.

• Notice a steady the increase is in my HR.

• Notice how smooth my cadence is, as reported from a dedicated cadence sensor. There are not major dips at power steps. See the relatively slow, but real decay in my cadence, as fatigue builds.

• There is also more power data fluctuation in the final steps, vs the earlier parts of the test, that show my real fatigue and difficulty pushing to the finish.

[iamholland]

@mcneese.chad

here is my latest Ramp test from a few weeks ago.

Wow, nice looking cadence!

For me, my natural cadence is 70. I have to make myself pedal @ 90RPM. So, when things get tough or I get tired, it drops significantly. I don’t know if Alan has the same “issue.” It’s a non-issue, IMO, but I’m trying to constantly increase my natural cadence.

[mcneese.chad]

Ha, thanks I try to be very smooth and steady for cadence whenever possible, but especially in ERG mode and testing at the top end. I started with around a 90 rpm average when I got into TR. Working on spin up drills seems to have lead me to about 97 rpm as my preferred cadence any more.

In tests, I have to watch it early to make sure I don’t over-spin into triple digits. I’ve done that from inattention in the past, and it seems to smoke me later on in the test. So if I limit on the front end, all I have to do is try to keep it near 95 and hopefully over 90 until I hit the entry to the ragged final 30 seconds or so.

I don’t push any cadence for people because it runs the range. However, seeing that much saw-tooth action in a test, especially in the final third seems like an issue one way or another. But I may have unrealistic expectations of what cadence steadiness is practical or acceptable for getting good results. That variability might be fine for some. I just know it would destroy me with that type of up/down cadence variation.