Feedback Needed: Polarized Plan Questions for the Community

I like 5-1 plan… It’s similar to what works for me… Would we have a way to move recovery weeks early if needed? I am taking more in regards of modified plans for triathlon

Sounds perfect, thanks Nate

Few of us were discussing exactly this point the other day here. A rigid 80/20 sessions ‘rule’ is nonsense as a training structure and it’s tiring hearing this ‘it’s not POL if it’s not 80/20’ line get repeated constantly.

People need to move on and see POL training as a range rather than anything so specific.

Loving there’s a 5 hour ride to work towards too!

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Are there a lot of people who would do a Polarized plan that only has 3.5 hours a week? That seems contradictory to me. I can definitely see the need for a “1 hard ride a week and at least 1 long ride on the weekend” plan, but I’m not sure anyone would want the 3.5 plan. I could be wrong.

I like the idea of mid/high being 2:1 or 5:1 in base and 3:1 in build.

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A lot of athletes are bound by life constraints or are totally new to training, so 3-5 hours of weekly training is their reality. We don’t want to limit those athletes in terms of what plans they can choose just because their lives don’t allow them to train more.

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In a polarized model, I actually think a recovery week is not needed. At least not for LV and MV. Maybe not even HV.

Yup. Longer intervals good.

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I get that, but in that case, I don’t think you’re going to see the benefits of a Polarized plan and would be better directed to focus on SSB. We shall see!

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I like roughly three Z3 workouts in a two week period. This is with about 12-15hrs total riding/wk.

Note the use of roughly and about. I base each day on how I’m feeling.

You nailed it with:

We’re curious to see what adaptations come as a result of these plans and will continue to make changes moving forward.

Consider this first batch of plans as if they are in the beta process of their release.

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I think the low-volume option is tricky. Either you shouldn’t offer it, or it should have two Z3 rides, or it should include weekly rides of 2+ hours at Z1. I’m guessing it’s going to be a grab bag of people who choose this, some of them might get killed by the 2Z3 rides, or don’t have time for two hours on the bike.

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Seiler has said that they have athletes do it every 4th week for the Polarized model.

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I agree. At that volume, it seems like you’d be better off just doing the HIIT plan. I’ve always though of a Polarized plan as a commitment to putting in long hours

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Absolutely.

Here is the first couple of weeks in HIT Maintenance Low Volume 1 plan:

My input based on doing spin classes in 2014-2015 is to do Tue/Thur at 45 minutes HIT, and then a longer 2 hour ride on Saturday.

Which isn’t polarized but is what I would do.

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For the rest intervals, I’ve done a lot of four by eights and five by eights, I would say that at lower percentages above FTP they should be two minutes, and at higher minutes they should be three. When I did higher percentages above FTP I failed workouts with only two minutes of rest.

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This would make it not polarized and just kind of like a lower volume of our SSB plan.

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That’s a big question. At what amount of hours does POL work? Is it different for different people at different training statuses? Does this work best for elite athletes or can a beginner at 3.5 per week get the same benefits as 2x Z3 + 1x Z2?

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Right, that would be why those work at low volume for athlete progression. Polarized training style developed to cope with high volume training, and seems to work for people in mid volumes. I just would say that you don’t offer it for low volume because the training stress would not be high enough, or, you could just offer it as experimental, results not guaranteed, then prove it doesn’t work with your own data.

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one last comment, you might consider:

  • Tue 45-min HIT
  • Thur 45-min tempo or top of z2 with some cadence work
  • Sat 2 hour middle z2

One thing for sure, I don’t envy your challenge of claiming POL plan at 3 workouts / 3.5 hours per week. Good luck!

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To answer the question @Nate asked in the OP, for Polarized plans, I recommend fewer recovery weeks since there are generally 1-2 rides with intensity (100% FTP or greater) each week, versus 2-3 plus one sweet spot for the current TR plans. So, for the 6-week plan I recommend 5:1.

I understand that Seiler recommended 4/8/16-minute intervals, and I agree with TR’s approach that their first POL plans use his recommended format. However, my understanding is that anything above LT2, which is approximately 100% FTP, is considered POL Z3. Therefore, TR could use the VO2 and Threshold progressions from the current Short and Sustained Power Build plans and substitute the weekend rides with POL Z1. Here’s my attempt at a Sustained Power Polarized Build (SusPPB) plan and a Short Power Polarized Build (SPPB) plan. Something to maybe file away for future POL plans as they evolve.

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But he doesn’t do this in practice. He’s much more flexible with the HIIT sessions and I think you can be too. Somehow it became internet dogma that in order to “do polarized” you had to use these interval modalities from his experimental studies. Seiler races Zwift, does threshold work, and has his daughter incorporate tempo runs regularly (for the pure cyclists on the thread, “tempo runs” are at or just below threshold). If you stick to the 4min, 8min, 16min intervals, the plan is unnecessarily inflexible.

Also most folks who have implemented a polarized approach have two low intensities. One is the standard Zone 2 (Coggan) intensity and the other a bit higher (yes, there is debate about how much higher, but there is still room to maneuver within that lower intensity…see Z1, Z2 of Norwegian zone system). If you look at workouts in Traditional Base HV, there are a few there that hit .70-75 IF. Those are great “upper lower intensity” sessions. Combine those with something like Baxter and you nailed it.

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On what volume though?

In a LV plan of say, 4 hours a week, with 3 hrs in Seiler Z1, and one Z3 workout, I don’t think a recovery week is needed. That’s a lot less intensity than, say, SSB which has 2-3 days a week of intensity.

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