@tshortt, I was doing great at 285 but 295 changed everything for my threshold workouts. This and other feedback has been quite helpful and positioning myself for successful workouts (hopefully) moving forward.
I am going to couple this with Kolie Moore FTP test.
Well lookie there: TTE.
You just leveled up, friend. Big time.
@SOWE34 This really is your answer right here (and why I don’t think you need to retest right now).
Check out 37:00 into this
(about 1-2mins listen)
At some point the KM protocol is nice because it will give you an equally important metric: TTE. But as it stands right now, the above “changed everything” comment that you made tells me no need to mess with it. And then just work under the assumption (if you care) that your TTE is 35mins.
My non-scientific approach is to round it up to the closest numeral of 5. So if AI says 293. I’ll set it at 290 but even as far as 285 - at 285 adaptive training will still work fine - and level 6+ threshold workouts are still daunting 
My non-scientific answer is 12% lower, 2% higher (within margin of error). And I never round up.
Personally I think why one is failing a given threshold workout is important. Kind of loops back to the KM podcasts where they talk a lot about how threshold should feel. They keep describing it as hard, but you’re under “control”, breathing isn’t going haywire, heart rate isn’t shooting past threshold level etc.
If you fail a threshold interval, with HR “in check” & breathing in check. Then maybe it’s more of a psychological reason? Being indoor and so on…
If you find breathing approaching VO2 levels with ditto HR shooting past your threshold level, then my guess is FTP is simply set too high, and you’re riding above threshold.
It should be almost impossible to fail such a workout unless it’s maybe at the very end of the workout with a ridiculously long time in zone.
When people claim that they are being crushed by a 10 minute FTP or SS interval then you have to immediately conclude that their FTP isn’t measured correctly. (Unless they are sick or the legs are fried from previous training.)
Dunno about jumping to the wrong ftp conclusion, unless it consistently happens. In my case its often “I don’t feel like tolerating being so uncomfortable right now.” Mentally giving up, because the legs are feeling lazy, or a little dehydrated, or a little hungover, or stressed about things, or whatever. My training is outside, when it happens far from home I have no choice but to keep riding and later in the ride I often find my legs and HTFU-mindset again. And then the work gets done. Would have long quit and been off the trainer if doing that workout inside.
There are certainly times I feel less comfortable with the discomfort of a hard workout. But other times I’ve been outside on a hard ride and my legs are dead and there’s no amount of HTFU mindset that will bring them back and it’s a long ride back with lots of stops to rest. For me, when those have happened it’s usually been the last hard workout before recovery week so I’ve been working hard and that last workout is just a bit much at that time.
Last night after slaying some mildly challenging threshold and vo2 work, I had close to an hour endurance back home into a headwind. Mentally drained from some work and mom drama, started eating and allergies kicked into overdrive. Felt like “put a fork in me, I’m done” and just wanted to get off the bike and kick back on the couch with a box of Kleenex and a Kombucha. Slow rolled while my legs played dead for awhile, and after 30 minutes of self pity it was mostly back to my usual steady endurance riding. Sometimes you just need to let go, free your mind and the rest will follow.
Did a level 4.6 threshold workout yesterday which I struggled through - it was a 12x3 @ 100% - I imagined this would be relatively easy as I’ve been nailing 7+ SS and. 6+ V02max sessions rating it easy in the following weeks - Although I came into it quite fatigued and I haven’t actually done any threshold work in a few weeks.
I couldn’t get my heart rate up, and my legs just felt empty - couldn’t push down on the pedals despite heart rate and breathing wise felt fine. I still completed the workout but rated it hard. Could this just be due to fatigue? I had a pretty hard v02max session and gym session (which I am still new to and adapting to it) on Tuesday and rock climbing session on Wednesday. (I probably answered my own question here).
Yes, textbook.
To the OP - it could also be the WO profile of Robion. It looked familiar. I did a few workouts with similar profile but lower PL. The 2 VO2ish middle intervals were brutal. I was able to do both workouts but marked as Very Hard and had some choice words in my written notes.
I am struggling the most with SS/threshold and recently started a thread about it. I find in these zones I am very sensitive to the profile. Some are just much harder for me (higher intensity, shorter rest) than others (longer workout times, more moderate end of zone). And I am finding TR being a little more liberal on how it categorizes workouts. Like the one you showed is SS, threshold and Vo2 in the same set.
Karakoram, Barker, Creise, Pavillion, Heng Shan, Rubion, Hillaby - they’re all tough! They just plain hurt. Do them more and maybe they hurt a bit less.
Turns out I failed that Friday workout and by Saturday afternoon I had come down with a sore throat and some chest congestion; trouble with have small children 
. Picked it up from visiting friends the weekend before. My body was telling me it was time for some rest. Took 5 days off and back at it again.
You are not the only one who fails Threshold!
I loathe it!
VO2Max
Anaerobic
Sprint
Those 3 I crush!
23@me said I’m Not a Fast Twitch. Guess they got my genetics wrong!
Honestly, It’s the Duration. The Time at… anything over 5 minutes… just kills me…well… I just suffer more!
I watch GCN+ RacePass while my legs scream, so do the fans! Whenever I get an AI FTP bump, I always make sure my workout is going to be Sweet Spot. I call it the Feel Test. I focus on the numbers. Power Numbers.
I relate Feel to a Number. I’ll do a few Sweet Spots if the first one didn’t feel right. I use the Levels accordingly and I think the AI is getting better the more I use it.
I wanted to say that also. It may not be that your threshold is too high. Robion is tough. I just finished “La Dama Blanca” which has the same profile but a few less watts. I completed but rated hard. Its a tough workout, going above threshold by so much when you are already 7 minutes in at threshold.
La Dama Blanca by varmstrong at Friday, Apr 29 2022 - TrainerRoad
Definitely highlights my weaknesses but I don’t think FTP is wrong.
I had “Jacks” today. 4 x 8 min at 105%, with 1 minute recovery in between. So that’s 32 minutes at 105% FTP.
It scared me before even doing it. I’m not sure if it’s expected to be possible with the correct FTP setting (it’s above my power curve), but it must be really close.
Despite failing it (2 backspins in the last intervals):
These Threshold workouts are the worst. VO2Max is hard but it’s over quickly and you get the recover. SS/Tempo is a little suffering. This is a lot of suffering, and it lasts.
This could have been written by me. My intervals icu eftp is 321 TrainerRoad AI ftp 320. The models agree unfortunately my body doesn’t! I Often overachieve on on/off type vo2 work but any intervals over 2 mins I struggle hugely. Recently AT decreased my threshold workouts interested to see how it works out!
I failed this exact workout today but it was only a 2.0! I’ve been training well up until a week ago (last week of specialty phase) where I really really struggled with my second last workout (Tuesday) but made it through and then failed the Saturday one. AI still put my ftp up slightly and I did a low level sweet spot workout the day of the AI detection and I made it through the Thursday Anaerobic workout (just) but knew as soon as I started this one I was really struggling. I’ve no clue wars gone wrong as up until last week I was feeling strong. The workouts were hard but doable - now I can’t get through a 2.0 
Robion, La Dama Blanca, Pavillon. These workouts are all pretty tough for me as well. Not the first two blocks, but the 2 minutes VO2 after the 1 minute VO2.
One thing to ensure is that you are properly fed for these workouts. They take a lot out of you. If your glycogen isn’t topped up it will seem much harder.
I have just finished La Dama Blanca a couple days ago and I have Robion monday. Not looking forward to it, especially as I am about to go do a long unscheduled ride today!