Agreed.
All I remember is a Mythbusters episode (can’t find on YouTube) where Adam showed a fatal amount of powdered caffeine and it didn’t seem like a lot.
I bought 250 pills/tablets 200mg of caffeïne for like 15 euro.
Just so happens to be that 200mg is almost 3mg/kg for me, so good dose to start long endurance rides.
Then I grind another pill to mix in my drink, for a 4hr ride that’s another almost 0,75 mg/kg/hr.
This way I don’t really have to worry about accidentally adding a whole gram or something and not sleeping for three nights.
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Not sure to ask here or to create a separate thread… But what about recovery drinks?
I have been using an off the shelve recovery mix after most exercises. This contains about 34g of carbs (of which 4g sugars) and 20g of protein (mix of whey concentrate and whey isolate) and a bunch of vitamines and electrolytes.
I increase the dose based on type of exercise and amount of wholefood taken after exercise.
What if I wanted to mix my own, what are the recommendations?
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If using powdered caffeine, it won’t be particularly soluble in cold water. I’d also wonder, but too lazy to look up, what the bioavailability of caffeine in pill form is.
Point is…. Won’t do you any good if it’s a precipitate at the bottom of your bottle, or if it passes through the GI and doesn’t get absorbed.
Good news is caffeine has been studied extensively so y’all can figure it out easily enough.
I’m, sadly, a caffeine non-responder. Have done a bunch of experiments over the years and it doesn’t do squat for me 
You need to measure in weight not volume. 1/2 cup of malto and 1/4 cup fructose is not meeting the 2:1 or 2:0.8 ratio. You need to use a kitchen scale to measure the 2 powders
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True. I used a kitchen scale the first couple of times to confirm that it is close enough to 2:1 for me. I’m just under 4 w/kg so the marginal gains of hitting exactly 2:1 (or 1:0.8) aren’t worth it to weigh every single time. I’d benefit far more from actually consuming 90g/hr, sleeping a lot more, and maybe shedding a few pounds.
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I just had a somewhat hilarious realization. With pure cane sugar being 1:1 fructose to glucose, I could just make Koolaid, add some salt, and have a near perfect hydration mix (exempting, of course, the artificial flavors and food coloring).
Koolaid… who would have thunk it?
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Tea bags are what I use. This is a relatively high-caffeine option (relative to normal tea, or to caffeinated gels etc): Celestial Seasonings | Black Energy Black Tea | FREE 1-3 Day Delivery
The rest is probably maltodextrin which acts like a sugar (high GI).
Recovery mixes like this probably aren’t necessary for most folks, unless you’re doing 2-a-day.
Might be a bit healthier and just as effective to use whey protein plus some fruit in a smoothie.
But certainly can’t beat the ease of that sort of thing.
Biggest message: post-workout nutrition specific matter MUCH less than pre- and intra-workout specifics for endurance athletes. The only exception to this rule is when that post-workout meal is also a pre-workout meal in the case of a 2-a-day.
@Dr_Alex_Harrison Just another anecdote but today was right at 6 hrs, 124 miles @ an IF of .82 fueled exclusively on your recipe advice. Did 120g/hr all day split over two bottles. The legs certainly felt tired at the end but they kept responding when asked. Feels like I’m cheating in a way. Thank you again, Sir.
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Heck yeah, @Motard!!!
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Grapejuice with water 70 / 30 1to one ratio clucose and fructose.
Hi all,
My recipe, just finished putting together one bottle, will try it later on the trainer and report back!
Ratios 1:0.8 on 500ml water for a 88,64g carb mix.
- 50g Glucose (Maltodextrine)
- 40g Fructose
- 15ml Raspberry sirup (flavor)
- 1g Electrolyte
- 1g table salt
Powders (EU based):
- Maltodextrin (Glucose)
- Fructose
- Electrolyte edit: this is now 80% more expensive
Flavor
- Raspberry syrup
Salt
- Some included in the electrolytes, will add a pinch of table salt (1g ?)
Any thoughts or improvements? Should I up the salt/electrolytes? Let me know!
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For EU users I found a good offer for Maltodextrin and Fructose here:
Isotonic drinks (laprimafit.com)
I also found a code for an additional discount of 25% → PROMO25
Does anyone have stomach issues with sodium citrate? I mixed up a few bottles for my ride today, using 1/2 tsp sodium citrate and 60g +/- Gatorade mix. I’ve done this before with no issues but it’s been a while. It didn’t end well today 
Should I ramp up the sodium citrate slowly to get used to it? I’ve been using plain Gatorade lately but was worried maybe I needed more electrolytes.
Thanks!!
Gatorade mix itself is one of the few things I’ve had issues with before. Maybe something with one of the colourings? It’s only when switching to Gatorade after I’ve been on other things for a long time (I’m in UK but from USA so have only ended up with Gatorade when visiting family). No issues after a few successive uses though.
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Hi…
there is a website called https://racepace.org/
free recipes on malto honey base…grape juice.
I swap some of the grapejuice in favor of more malto, as i am not able to digest fructose pretty solid anymore …
Usually this amount isn’t problematic. Almost never because of sodium concentration at this amount.
Dehydrated before training?
Super high-intensity training?
What else did you consume before & during training?
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In this case, it was supposed to be a Z2 ride that got a little spicy 
Breakfast was my usual pre-ride pancakes and maple syrup 2+ hours before the ride, and stomach distress happened after 2.5 hours of riding.
I can’t rule out being a bit dehydrated though. I often forget to drink enough on colder rides (45F or so in this case).
I’m glad to hear it’s likely not the sodium! I’ll have to keep an eye on hydration going forward.
Thank you!!! @Dr_Alex_Harrison