You forgot, “I thought I was a special snowflake?” digging into the way-back-podcast-machine.
I think some of the disconnect might be that everyone wants the new features but being a beta tester is not for the majority of people, you’re going to run into bugs and issues as part of the program. Imo most people are going to be happier waiting until things run smoother to be let into the testing.
Full disclosure I was one of the lucky ones to get into the beta. I find this really fun, I do the same thing at work, I’m not in IT but am part of a group that gets to test beta software and finding bugs and new features is a blast to me.
As a System Admin, I have been a part of many beta along with alpha groups. 95% of the TR user base should not want to be in any closed beta in the beginning stages. Right now they need people that can adapt quickly to issues that come up, provide timely feedback, and communicate concisely the problems they are seeing. That last part is key and most don’t have a clue how to communicate issues they see. They just know it doesn’t work.
Everyone needs to stop picking on @Nate_Pearson for the way he communicated about the closed Beta. He was clear it was a closed beta. We can’t expect him to communicate everything to the level of a toddler all the time. He is one of the best communicators I have ever seen when he doesn’t owe us anything. He genuinely cares and we can all see it. Please don’t take your frustrations out on him because it isn’t your time yet to get in the beta, or you didn’t understand what a closed beta is. Remember how great this company is, and how great all the leadership is. Trust Nate and rest of the team. They got the company this far and it doesn’t look like they are slowing down anytime soon - no matter how upset some of us get for them not doing things exactly as we think they should be.
Please don’t take this as attacking anyone. We all want Nate/TR to continue being transparent and I can’t help but want us to do what we can to not thwart that transparency in the future.
BTW - for transparency I am NOT in the beta yet.
I’m so glad someone wrote this post! Well said Jeramy!
You only need to watch or listen to ten minutes of the podcast to see how invested and passionate Nate is about TR. Frankly Amber, Chad and Jonathon seem to be right there with him.
Actually every TR person I’ve read answer questions on the forum has been helpful, patient and knowledgeable.
TR you rock.
To be fair, Nate talks often about Radical Candor and criticizing with empathy. Hell, even his comments on the podcast yesterday mentioned how being a good communicator isn’t about saying something clearly one time.
My criticism of not explaining what a closed beta is and how it operates were a reflection of those attitudes and the continuous improvement he and his team strive for at all levels. It didn’t hit the right mark for communication in this instance, but that just means they have an area of improvement for next time. But that one thing doesn’t discount all the good communication they do on a regular basis. As far as I’m concerned, they are doing an outstanding job with everything despite all the directions they are being pulled in right now. I couldn’t be prouder to watch them all flourish.
I know, I’m doing the bad thing of replying to myself. Mea culpa.
But I forgot one important alternative.
Announce open beta, let everyone get in:
5 minutes later, 400 posts here saying “Hey, it’s full of bugs! And it’s taking way too long to fix them!”
Agree to all your points and this is why we love TR and the team. They are not afraid to make mistakes, apologize for it, and make it right. How many companies can you say that about? I do some volunteer counseling at church and I tell parents (and spouses) all the time to learn how to make mistakes and apologize (ask for forgiveness) to your kids no matter how old they are. It is amazing how connected they become to you when you are real with them. Same thing applies here. Think about it - we love TR not for the mistakes they make, but for being teachable and humble enough to admit they are wrong, apologize if needed and make it right. How can we not love a company like this? And in the end the company and the customers are all better for it.
My main reply was about how many are acting like it’s Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory. Nate (Willy) is opening up his heart, visions, and goals for TR (Chocolate Factory) and the majority of us are like the bratty kids with the golden tickets. We either want it now no matter what or we think we know better on what needs to be done or how they should have released it. In reality we just need to take a step back and be more like Charlie - appreciate what we are seeing and enjoy the ride. And, who knows - maybe we can learn a thing or two from Mr. Wonka (Nate).
Sorry but your post comes across as TR users are incapable of reporting errors that come up which in a timely fashion, etc which I don’t think is true.
While I don’t think it should be the masses in the beta and this is the right way to do it I think it is mainly about the communication approach.
AT is not really here or ready for prime time yet. Fair enough but don’t make it out like it is ready. It does not bother me I am not in the beta and a huge TR fan but if anyone has been a sub for any length of time this launch seemed a bit rushed vs previous launches.
Edit: I am not in the beta yet but can wait as I don’t have the time to be in it with work and travel.
Ok off to do a TN workout. Have a good day all and keep up the good work TR.
You guys must be really bored to be nitpicking this so much. The CEO of the company has written back to you directly when he probably has better things to do like get out the actual product… Clearly they are doing their best, maybe just give them a chance?
People seem to do much more talking on here than reading because most of the posts I see the TR team making are answering questions that have already been answered.
I’m curious then, have most TR users been in a closed beta before? Do they know how to read logs and understand what went wrong? Do they know how to troubleshoot software and hardware for companies? In the beginning, developers need more than just what the problem is. They need as much details as possible and even how you may have found a workaround for the problem. Personally, I don’t see many TR users giving the details needed at this point due how time consuming troubleshooting can be. Anyway, I hope this clarifies my thinking on being able to reports errors in a timely fashion and I hope we can still be friends! 
Oh come on, TR beta users don’t need to read logs, I’m sure the engineers get the logs automatically. Not only that, they said most of the heavy lifting is done server side anyway. Being able to describe the behavior should be more than enough for them to gain value from the beta users. This has been in alpha for who knows how long as well. They say they have been using internally for awhile, hence why they are ready to start expanding it to less technical users.
Totally agree. There are too few companies out there that showcase an actual heart, and TR is certainly one of them that bears it all. Their earnest, honest attitudes and display of radical candor are all things I truly admire and look to emulate in myself more and more. Here’s to hoping I’m becoming a better leader for applying the practices they preach.
EDIT: Also, @VeloJake is right. I’m in the beta and there are no logs necessary. My role is to play around with the app, provide feedback and share when things are not working as intended. I take a ton of screenshots and share exact steps for what led me to the problem. I also share some of the steps I may have taken to resolve the problem so they know my experience with those as a user as well. It’s really about reporting on an experience as thoroughly and clearly as possible with as much information is there is available. As a journalist for my day job, I find this fits right into my wheel house of skills to share experiences as clearly as possible.
@BCrossen @ericallenboyd @VeloJake
I understand I am wrong about logs and I apologize to everyone including @VeloJake . I was basing this on past alpha/beta groups I have been apart of. @BCrossen - You are proving what a good beta tester is by how you are reporting things. There again, it can be pretty time consuming and not sure how many would do the same. On the other side, I get it, and I was wrong for making it look like most TR users are incapable of being good beta testers and I apologize to everyone including @ericallenboyd. My point was more how many TR users would be willing to do what it takes or want to provide so many details? My assumptions are that most want to just it in, get their workout done and get out. I could be wrong here as the joy of being a beta tester is that you feel you played a role in bringing it to the masses, and most TR users may be willing to do whatever it takes to be apart of that for AT no matter how much time is needed.
See? Communication is hard! No matter how well you think you are coming across, it can be taken another way you didn’t plan. Insert a little grace for TR/Nate/Teams here… 
You mean, like every bike, phone, car company does?
Oh wait, they do not. They get people hyped up with an announcement about a product being released “somewhen in the future” (in the case of bikes and graphics cards, if they can find some stock)
I desperately want to get AT.
I also think I have the experience and the know-how to report accurately bugs, issues, workarounds, and follow instructions for more detailed troubleshooting.
I also have no time to do all of this, which means that, had I been in the initial group of 50, my contribution to the beta would have been negative, and the contribution of the beta to me getting faster, likewise.
Hence why I signed up about 7 days after it was announced.
I was included in this group and have been using AT over the last week. Initial feedback, everything works as advertised! I have a race this weekend and the lead in was not so smooth because of a busy work week that caused a couple missed workouts. AT adjusted my training plan and I used Train Now to add a workout on an off day, and feel like my lead in to the race is on track.
I’ve enjoyed looking at my training levels and seeing how a workout will push those levels up. I am hopeful and excited for the TR team to provide more context on what these levels mean and perhaps provide targets based off of cycling goals.
I haven’t experienced any bugs/issues when using AT either on the iPhone TR app or when accessing my account online. I’ll continue to share feedback as I get more time with AT.
I believe the real value in AT won’t be seen until a few weeks into a training plan. While it goes to work immediately, it provides a nuanced approach to shaping your training over time and I’m excited to see how that plays out.
^^^ This. I’m the Director of Communication for my organization and I wish my leaders were as forthcoming and transparent with information as @Nate_Pearson … he is setting a great example for other leaders to follow.
I think they announced because even those 188 were going to be talking about it. So everyone would know, might as well control what it is etc
@bnied have the next 100 users have been invited to the closed beta yet?
I think so too. You can’t get around the need to test stuff out with real users. If you do it without announcing, then you’re leaving it to other people to do all the explaining. Of course, there will be lessons learned about their process and staffing levels to make each new major feature release smoother and faster. But for now, I’m looking forward to the new features and think the rollout has been about as good as can be.