3 x 100 TSS vs 6 x 50 TSS

What would the pros and cons (and differences) of structuring a 300 TSS week as either 3 rides of 100 TSS or 6 rides of 50 TSS be?

Will there be differences in the adaptions?

Will recovery be easier in one than the other? Will that be impacted by age?

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There are so many factors and variables involved that it’s impossible to answer that question. Just hit the easy button and follow a TR plan. Too often people over complicate their training when most would be better off following an established proven structured plan.

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Hi there.
6 x 50 TSS rides (1 hour in length) is basically doing 6 endurance (easy) rides and is a great recovery week plan.

3 x 100 TSS rides (90 minutes) is a great week to get in some serious training and adaptations. These workouts are mainly threshold work.

3 x 100 TSS rides could also be long endurance rides (2 hrs) and make for recovery as well.

Remember all TSS is not created equal.

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I’m sorry, but that is just a cop out or a non-answer. Also, if it was just about “stop thinking, just follow the plan!” there would not have been the wealth of interesting discussion, there has been on this forum.

There must be someone who has tried similar structures and have noted the differences or perhaps have read studies…

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I did not think it was necessary, but I guess I should have noted that the two different structures would include similar workouts, just split up when doing the 6 x 50 structure, so the time at different intensities would be the same.

Note that I never stated anything about the duration of each ride. Obviously 50 TSS accrued by doing something like Morgan - 5 (30 min VO2max workout) is completely different from 50 TSS from a 90 min endurance ride. That is not what I am talking about, though.

Not a cop out answer, you just posed an unanswerable question without providing further context. Also, many try to alter plans for one reason or another when they would have been far better off just following a plan as scripted. Then, if needed make small plan changes to accommodate life interuptions. So that WAS my answer.

I’m curious the reasoning behind this question, unless it was just for curiosity and to invoke discussion? Do you have too much time and want to train 6 days a week (6 x 50 TSS)? Do you not have enough time to train and want 3 big days ( 3 x 100 TSS)? What exactly are you trying to accomplish here? What are your goals, your phase of training, your experience with structured training, your age, your other life stressors? These among others are all the variables that direct the discussion and answer. If you want a BS answer based on nothing then you’re more than welcome to elicit that.

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One big con for the 6x50TSS case is that you will never develop any endurance because by definition you will be doing all of your efforts basically fresh. The last part of the last interval is where the highest quality training stress (for endurance) is experienced and this will be basically non-existent.

One (minor?) pro for the 6x50TSS case is that it might be good for developing short-term power with impeccable form. However, you will have limited applicability for this short-term power because you won’t last long enough to use it in a race or event that is longer than 30mins.

Just stick to the Time Crunch 30 plans. :+1:

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Just guessing here but, fatigue resistance would be a touch different (if all the TSS was gained in the same way ie tempo, endurance, etc…).

With only 300 tss a week probably your results would be similar as long as overall plan was equally varied in intensity. Two 30 min vo2 max sessions at 50 tss a week won’t produce noticeably different adaptations than one 60 min session imo

If the rides are at endurance pace, better to do fewer longer rides.

For higher intensity rides, you can get a good workout in 45-60 mins.

If you are capped at 300 TSS, do the low volume plans. And maybe swap the weekend ride for a long outdoor ride.

Hmm… I thought I was being concise and to the point, but it would seem I should have explained my question better…
I was not looking for “special snowflake” (the special snowflake being me) type of advice on which of the structures to follow (with my constantly changing work schedule, I wouldn’t be able to follow any of them to the letter anyway). What I was after, was more of a principal discussion on what the differences would be, based either on scientific studies or personal experience with similar structures.

I’m sorry I didn’t explain it better…

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You won’t get that without further information, mainly of what TYPE of TSS you are engaging – Zone 1-7.

The way you present your “question” is meaningless without context, as @MI-XC pointed out.
It’s like asking “Which screwdriver should I use?”.

You could do 12hr @40% FTP (Z1) or 2hr @120% FTP (Z5) for ~300 TSS.

You could do 6x20min or 3x40min VO2max sessions/week.
Can YOUR physiology (and psychology) adapt/recover from 6 VO2 workouts in a row?

You could do 6x1.5hr or 3x3.25hr Endurance (Z2) workouts/week.
The nature of Z2 work is well known enough that longer is always better.

My advice: research and read (instead of being grumpy when you don’t get the answers to mis-worded question you are looking for).

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The basic problem here is that a complex set of idea is being compressed and represented into a single number (TSS). Then THE question becomes, what does that number mean. This is a common problem in organisations (Profit), economics (GDP) and training (TSS). The real question is “What is going on underneath this headline number?” and “What specific type of decision was this number introduced to inform?”

So, as others have argued, you could even do a a single ride of 600 TSS, once every 2 weeks. Or 6 rides of 50 TSS in a week. The appear the same to average weekly TSS!

TSS Is only a general measure of effort vs functional threshold, over a ride, and over a period. It is not a measure of the details of how that ride was carried out, or the various variety and intensity of each ride.

TSS is a measure of the overall training load and stress. (Hours and miles are two others). It is used to interpret the increase in effort and training load against FTP. The training stress: hence its name. Looking at TSS in a day, week or 6 week period provides different indications of training stress and trends. (A richer view that hours, or miles, alone).

To interpret the detail on the type of training, you have to look at the individual intensity and time and patterns of each ride, and then look at the pattern over time. You cannot interpret (or even hallucinate) the individual training effects under those TSS figures. You have to have an understanding of the detail and what you are trying to achieve.

The takeaway: BEWARE AGGREGATED SINGLE FIGURES THAT HIDE DETAIL AND MASK MEANINGFUL INTERPRETATION. USE THEM ONLY FOR THE PURPOSE FOR WHICH THEY WERE INTENDED, AND THE DECISIONS THEY WERE DESIGNED TO INFORM.

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On average, Michael Jordan and I have scored 15 points per game in the NBA.

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I would say it depends also on your goals. It is obvious that if you are training for a fondo, you need prolonged rides. If you are training for crits, sacrificing longer rides and compensating with higher frequency with a decent specific intensity dosage would better suit you in general.
Then there is the individual aspect. Some people just respond better to higher training frequency. Others can get decent form just with a couple of long rides per week.
I am not on that boat. My general fitness improves much more from riding daily even if only for 30 minutes with low intensity that from doing the same volume distributed by 3 or 4 weekly longer rides.
So just follow the plan and see what suits you best using (some of) the Calendar flexibility.

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I am a fan of frequency myself, it helps to establish a good routine and consistency. After getting consistent on 6 days a week, you can then start to look for low hanging fruit and how to incrementally add in some extra time on the one day or two days to start getting in some longer rides. Coming back to regular activity after dad duties, I went with the frequency route. Even up until this current training year I didn’t do anything over 2 hours, and they don’t need to be really hard stuff but mixing up the intensities will keep things fresh.

Love the use of the word “grumpy”. Exactly the correct word when you don’t want to offend but need to be honest :rofl:

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As per the book, you need to stay around 0.70 - 0.80 IF range per week. If you are above this range, then you are over training, if you below it, you need to check your training schedule and/or your FTP.

As far as I understand from the book’s content, it is not the TSS but it is IF. You can then structure it as you wish to.
For example I had 90min workout today with 119 TSS and 0.89 IF. Considering this weekend’s criterium race, I am going to do 60min with 80TSS with same IF. This way I will take down my fatigue while push fitness and form up.

Hey TR, we need performance management chart ASAP please :slight_smile:

Quote:“I’m sorry, but that is just a cop out or a non-answer.”

That was rather rude of you I think.
The guy gave you a polite answer that he thought was justified.
I think you will get better replies if you don’t attack someone so quickly, whether intentional or inadvertently imho.