Who's over 60 y/o and using TR?

It is personal but as you get older you generally have more difficulty in retaining/growing muscle strength.
As such to retain the same power output cadence has to rise. So it is somewhat related to age.

I’ve heard otherwise:

and can only tell you I easily put on muscle this year, in my late fifties. A lot of 60+ guys at our gym and they are ripped.

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Interesting. My resting HR is and has always been 68 +/-. Even when I’m in top shape. So, I guess that’s 35% of my peak. When I’m riding my bike hard outside and am not paying attention to my HR, it will easily push into the low 180s - but then drop right back down to a “normal” tempo HR of 130-140. I wish I had the legs like some of you all, my FTP has peaked at 234 and I’d love to get it up to 260, but gains come slowly!

I’m 69. Started being coached by Peaks Coaching Group in June and doing structured training, 400 - 700 TSS/week range since. Recently started using TrainerRoad in preparation for coaching myself. Happy with PCG but it’s expensive. Lots of improvements and still going strong. Most of my workouts have been outdoors but recently got a Kickr and am going to focus more on indoor efforts because the terrain in Fort Worth, TX doesn’t lend itself to long sweet spot intervals - too much up and down.

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You’re my hero! I’m not worthy… :grinning:

Those TSS were mostly earned outdoors. I just got a Kickr and I’m amazed at how the RPE for the same workout is so much higher on the Kickr. I can do 4 X 4 low VO2 max intervals on the road. They aren’t easy but they aren’t terribly difficult. But when I try to match that on the Kickr it’s much, much harder.
I expect my weekly TSS will come down as I start doing more workouts on the Kickr.
It’s difficult to find a steady climb or a flat section long enough here (Fort Worth, TX) to do a 10 minute SSI. There are too many downhills where I can’t put out SS power.
I actually look forward to days with a strong headwind because they allow me to do longer intervals at the assigned power.

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For years my legs have given out well before my heart/lungs have. Since my aerobic system does relatively well I keep my cadence high because that taxes my aerobic system more than it does my legs. I’m 69. My max HR is 157, resting 42.

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That sounds reasonable to me.

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The gradual loss of muscle mass as you get older is medically known as Sarcophenia.
Sure there will be exceptions and outliers but the principle is correct. One way of combating that as a cyclist is to increase cadence. There are other ways as well.

Gonna hit this question quickly on Thursday, Doc. I just added it to the rapid-fire segment. I plan to keep it playful but interesting.

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Yes, and I was responding to your “more difficulty in retaining/growing muscle strength” comment earlier. As best I can tell, there is a strong case for “use it or lose it” when it comes to growing and retaining muscle strength. The earlier you get started the better off.

I’ve seen no evidence that increasing cadence helps fight sarcopenia. As far as I’ve read, you need to lift heavy.

I couldn’t help commenting on Nate’s workout today after I completed Baird +6 today (even if his NP was only 90 W above mine.) :rofl:

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Anyone done the 20 minute ftp test on TR? I see the ride. Does it give you a ftp like the ramp test once you’re done? I’m assuming I wouldn’t do it in Erg mode. I’m thinking start the first 5 minutes at my current ftp (236) and add 5 percent every 5 minutes and ride to blow up the final 5 minutes.

I suck at VO2 efforts but can ride sweet spot pretty easy at my current ftp. I think I’m a little under rated, who doesn’t? Just below 3 w/kg. Today was Erickson 5x10 with lots left in the tank. During my ramp test once I pass 300 watts my cadence starts to drop and I get to futile cadence in the next minute.

Thanks for the old fart support group.

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Yes the 20-minute test will give you FTP estimate at the end. If you are setup for Erg it will switch you to resistance mode at the start of 20-min portion of the test. First time I did it the resistance was too low and I had to quickly adjust. You may want to do Free Rode workout beforehand to set resistance to proper level for the test.

Doc, I have done the TR Ramp Test several times. Despite hard workouts, I had difficulty getting a bump in FTP. I did an alternative based on the Kolie Moore protocol which is a longer but lower wattage test. I tried KM inside and then outside, resulting in a 20 watt bump higher than the TR Ramp Test. I think the Ramp Test may not accurately measure FTP in senior cyclists who are VO2 limited. More about my experience here: Kolie Moore's FTP test protocol - #535 by DavidWms

I don’t think that happened on my Kickr. It stayed in erg for entire test.

Hmm, switching modes is mentioned in the video on the 20-minute test page: Log In to TrainerRoad

It is also in the workout notes that appear in the TR app - I brought up WorkoutCreator and copied the notes displayed during the test. Here is a few snippets of what appears in the TrainerRoad app between the 5-min all-out effort and 20-min test:

“For those of you on electronic trainers…”
“you’ve probably noticed you’re back in Erg mode”
“But when that upcoming 20-minute effort begins…”
“we’ll automatically switch you back to Slope mode (3%)…”

and earlier, just before the 5-min all-out:

“Before we get to the advice regarding the upcoming 5-minute interval…”
“a quick note to riders on electronic trainers in Erg mode”
“During this 5-minute & the 20-minute effort…”
“we’ll automatically shift into Slope mode for you…”
“meaning you’ll USE YOUR GEARS…”

I’m sorry. I thought you and Doc were talking about the TR Ramp Test, which seems to be the default FTP test now (and what I had tried to set my FTP.) I see now the 20 minute FTP test is different.

no worries I was on a conference call, glad we got that sorted out! And yes, the Ramp Test is the new default and stays in Erg mode if you have a smart trainer. Have a great weekend!

Great podcast and great news! I would love for Chad and the gang to do a deep dive podcast on getting faster for older athletes. Not just work/recovery ratio, but also things like the importance of VO2max, strength training and nutrition to reduce muscle atrophy, flexibility work etc.

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