For me I want reliable hubs that require as little maintenance as possible. I’ve had two crap hubs on Vittoria wheels that corroded the very first time they rode in rain. Never again. The free-wheeling is third in priority because I don’t race and the marginal gains of slightly lower rolling resistance aren’t worth the increased maintenance to me. I’m more limiting than my bike and I want it to just work. I’m a huge fan of DT Swiss 240s.
One thought, is if you can get DT350, you avoid the newer DT 240’s with their problems, and because the 350’s are so loved, you preserve good resale of your wheels. You build up with some aliexpress DT knock offs or Novatech etc, and the used wheels are not really as desirable.
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I’ll argue both ways here. My everyday wheels - that also double as my shallow / wet race wheels - run on White Industries T11’s. Like everyone else, it seems, I don’t have a bad word to say about them. Easy to service, rugged, etc. Someone really thought about them, and it shows.
My race wheels on the other hand, are a set of 60mm Light Bicycles running on bitex hubs. They’re super-light, they build into an acceptable wheel, bearings are small, and apparently prone to water ingress. I’ve had them about 8 months, prob about 10-12 races on them, they roll as smooth as you like, right now. ( I’m pretty sure I never lost a race thanks to a couple of missing degrees of engagement…ymmv. Can’t say I’ve even thought about it until I saw this thread.)
It’s pretty unlikely I’d have more than 2000 race k’s in a year. If I have to replace the bearings next year - well, I went in with my eyes open, and I’m sure a decent set of NTN’s isn’t going to break the bank. Given the rate at which rim brake stuff is disappearing from the market - I’m not sure I’ll be riding these much more than a couple more years. Resale value - for rim brake stuff, I figure that’s a crapshoot…bottom line, for a pair of road wheels that aren’t going to do moon mileage, that you don’t envisage rebuilding and reusing, etc…the novatecs, miches, and bitex’s of this world aren’t terrible things to be lumbered with.
I can’t speak to gravel or MTB!
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Front hub, for sure, as mostly you could replace the bearings. The really bad ones could be like this, but that’s about it. Flange failures seem pretty rare these days. I actually have a Stans NoTubes Neo boost hub on a wheel, and it uses common bearings and the Torque Caps were $20 rather than $43 for DT ones, so it’s fine. Those hubs are new for $20-40 on eBay pretty often (DT equivalent is $50-75 on eBay new).
Rear though, freehub designs on some hubs do seem to just be poor (Stans Neo etc). So worst case you have failure and can’t get a replacement (so you’re up for new hub, wheel build, maybe spokes). Best case you have a failure and a new free hub is $30 or $40, but may have to come from China. Even better case is that it’s a DT star ratchet knock off and fits genuine DT Swiss freehubs.
I purchased a used DT350 boost rear hub for $50 on eBay recently. Typically they go for more around the $100 mark. If one thing goes wrong on a cheaper hub, then you end up financially worse (replacement free hub, having to buy new bearings or get it fixed if you don’t have the tools). If nothing goes wrong and you never sell the wheels, then you’ll have saved money.
Cheap hubs - probably okay, heavier, just fingers crossed that you don’t have failures of bearings or free hubs that eat up all you savings.
Mid range hubs - DT350’s are awesome and I’d say anyone building wheels should at the very least price them up to make sure they’re not being ignored because you’re worried they’re too expensive, when in fact they’re cheap (eBay used mostly for me, although some eBay new ones too).
Hight end - I’ve had five sets of Chris King hubs over the years. I went away from CK because they’re never DT 350 cheap (even used), and axles and free hubs are just so expensive compared to DT when you want to upgrade as standards change.
On my MTB over a certain level of POE it just becomes a novelty. I do a lot of technical climbing, but not trials, and the 42 POE on my Hope Pro-4’s is enough. I can’t say I have had a problem doing technical, rocky climbs with 42 POE that were because of the hubs. The 72 I had on another hub was nice, but not needed. I bought the Hope 4’s after a good experience with some Hope 2’s (which are on my spare wheelset now).
My roadie is low POE, just two pawls in there. But I never miss the engagement as I don’t spend a lot of time going on and off power. But those wheels (10ish year old Mavic Cosmic) have been dead reliable, and that is way more important to me. 30000 miles, including rain commuting and BWR.
Plus 1 Million and great call out.
DT 350’s are my default hub now. CK, I9, White Industry, have them too and are wonderful and look nice. But the good old 350 is a great choice.
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All I know is that I love my Hydras and the lack of engagement when I ride “normal” hubs is very noticeable. They are also really easy to service, even though they require little maintenance.
For sure, the Hydra’s are great. You do pay more (looks like $200 more for a rear vs DT350) and free hubs (if you ever swap) are $200 vs $70 for a DT. Weight is close, although the Hyrda’s seem about 10 grams lighter. Hydra’s resale is definitely better. Engagement, I’m not sure anyone can notice CK vs i9 vs DT with 56t ratchet. Sure, they sound different, but can you actually notice the change in engagement angle?
Really comes down to what you can afford. And as I said before: Before you go cheap, price up DT 350’s. Before you go expensive (CK, i9, 240) price up DT350’s and decide if you need/want to spend the extra.
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Just curious… what kind of service interval did they prescribe for your CK hubs? I was told every four-six months depending on how often you ride…
Yeah, nothin wrong with 350’s. I’m just an I9 fanboy I guess lol.
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Since we’re talking hubs, if considering the Enve Foundation wheels, which hub do you recommend - Enve Alloy or i9? Price is the same.
That seems VERY short unless you’re constantly riding in muddy conditions.
Exactly… which was a turn off to me when I heard that… of course, I didn’t follow up to ensure if it was true or not - cause I trust the techs at my LBS… lol
They said a year or two. I have 5k miles on them and I haven’t serviced them. I checked my rear hub and it still looked new, so I am pretty happy with the service interval recommendations. Chris king service manual says 1-2 years or 3-6 months in wet or muddy conditions.
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I’ve got the T11s too. I got them because of the titanium free hub body and steel axle, after destroying the freehub body and axle in a novatec hub. I am on the chubby side for a cyclist, 93 kilos right now, so I prefer beefier hubs. T11s are quite light too, and easy to service. I love how they sound!
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Per Chris King hub manual which is on their website, every 3-6 months if your running them in wet and muddy conditions. Otherwise 12-24 months. I just did mine on my road wheels this fall after ~18 months and the grease still looked like new.
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Another +1 for White Industries. I have two sets of wheels built on the CLD disc hubs. Rock solid, smooth spinning, and love that sound!
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I upgraded the wheels on my mountain bike to i9 hubs and I could not tell the difference. Even when I travelled and rented a bike with “normal” hubs I could not say which one was better. The main difference is the noise, other than that it feels the same. I’m not saying it’s a waste of money, if I’m looking at upgrading wheels in the future I would happily buy them again but I can’t state tangible differences.
No 16t from DT afaik, it’s 18/36/54.
Agreed on the grease being expensive on its own, but the dumonde stuff isn’t much cheaper. I just use the tube that was included in a ratchet upgrade kit, should last decades at my rate of usage.
IIRC, the DT240EXP issue is ~solved at this point, as it was present only for a portion of a specific batch/run of parts.