Training Plan - overrule AI and push the limit?

Hi all, after good gains in my last two FTP Tests (each time + 10 W) I find myself constantly overruling the suggested workouts, because AI (over)adjusts after gains. Typically i can push up intensity rating by 1 to 2 points. Do i keep pushing the limit until i (barely) fail a workout? So far not fatigued and always ambitious. Thanks!

Entirely up to you. Depends on your goals, training history, etc

I did what your talking about one month, I dug deep 3 times a week, it put me in a hole for an extra week.


Trust the process. The TR team has been talking about “minimum effective dose.” Gains can be without feeling wiped out. And long term, better to mail the plan and stick with it than blow yourself up. I get the temptation but with AI, there really isn’t the need to do this anymore.

1 Like

I just feel AI is too cautious. Without AI (last year) i kept going through the progressions without those adjustments and it was a little too hard every once in a while. Now it Scales back to a point where i just don’t feel challenged. After a week 1 override AI does ok for Weeks 2 and 3

You don’t say if you’ve an event or race that you are training for. If you are then AT will aim to peak you for that and not before, what’s the point of doing otherwise? Overdoing things now will lead to problems in the longer term.

Just what happens after an FTP change seems to vary between users: some see a drastic drop in PLs, maybe all the way down to 1.0; while others, like myself, only see a drop of 0.1 or 0.2 in some PLs.

If you feel that AT isn’t pushing you hard enough then use the post ride survey and mark your workouts as “Easy” or “Moderate” (or at least easier than AT probably “thinks” it should be), AT should see that and offer you harder workouts.

1 Like

This has been my 5th winter using TR, and the first with all of the adaptive training/progression levels/AI FTP detection tools. Looking back at it now, my training has been easier this year than previous years, and the constant feeling throughout has been that I could handle harder workouts than were being served up. I’ve never failed a workout in base or build In previous winters (although Speciallity often threw up one or two workouts that I couldn’t complete)

For example, my final VO2 session in Sustained Power Build MV this year was Red Lake +8. This workout was usually served up a couple of days after the FTP test half way through build - and the difficulty would only ramp up from there through the remainder of the plan.

Some observations, now that I’ve finished a base/build cycle:

  1. The reduced training demand has been so much easier for my 48 year old body (and mind) to cope with.

  2. FTP improvements have been as good, if not better, with the ‘easier’ training demands

  3. Red Lake +8 is so much easier three weeks after an FTP bump than it is three days after!

All in all, I’m a big fan of the new ‘minimum effective dose’ approach. I’d suggest that you trust the new tools, and resist the temptation to overrule the suggestions. I just think you’ve got very little to gain, and potentially more to lose, by trying to outsmart the AI.


All through SSBHV and SustainedPBHV I’ve had to choose slightly harder workouts through Alternates. I do this whenever I feel like the ramp rate or workout looks too easy. I’d just suggest be modest and don’t go past 0.5 of your suggested workouts. Also, this should be an occasional adjustment and not every week.


Just compared suggested values to the original build plan and what is suggested is off by almost 3. That‘s why I am a little confused. Played it safe in week one and did not feel challenged. Then I made significant adjustments to VO2 and Anaerobic while playing it safe with threshold…went smooth.

I think I will give the workouts from the original plan a shot even though that means upping by 2 again. It is build phase after all and I should overload :wink: Remaining cautious with threshold however knowing that this is a relative weakness.

Even pushing it like that TSS is still 10% below the value I would have had following the original plan. Maybe I should add that I had Covid early January and think that gains are coming faster than they would normally because of this setback.

Keep us updated on how it goes. I’m interested to hear how you’re feeling by the end of build and by your event

I’ve thought the opposite in SSBhv2. I was told by the AI FTP detection to increase my threshold. When I did that my SS zone “reset” from 8.9 to 8.3 and the first workout AI gave me was a 9.4.
I didn’t do it as scheduled but swapped to something around 8.3.

I do like AI overall though. It is nice to now workouts are not static and change be changed around based on what we’ve done/getting ready to do/or changes in fitness.

Update: First failed workout today…Threshold of course :sweat_smile:

VO2 went well: 3.7 to 7.6 in two steps. But could tell 7.6 was tough the Day after.

Threshold: 3.6 —> 4.2 —> 5.3 —> fail at 6.4 :hot_face: Albeit with 2 new all time PBs

Anaerobic: 6.2 —> 8.0 w/o issues

Looking at historic data 6 seems to be my magic number for struggling with threshold.

What did I learn?

  1. Careful with pushing threshold
  2. Consider Historic Data / Big Picture
  3. Trust AI a little more
1 Like

Keep us in the loop on what happens with your training over the next several weeks. How do your progressions improve from here? How does your cumulative fatigue change your perception of future weeks?

Sometimes an FTP increase will actually lead AT to adapt a workout to something easier than originally planned pre ftp increase

1 Like