Sweet Spot Progression

That is called tempo zone :smile:

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Extensive: push curve out to the right with a goal to get to 200% of TTE for TiZ in SST for a ride. ex. 45min TTE, build up from 45min TiZ to 90min TiZ (thatā€™s why people are talking about 90min as ā€œmostā€ people sit around 40-65min TTE)
After that you move to Intensive - push the curve up - Threshold work, target getting to 150% TTE in single ride ie. 1hr at threshold using same 45min TTE
VO2 - hit on that.

Rinse - repeat.

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This, all the way.

Yes, there are probably some people who do need to break things down more and gradually work short > long, but some people donā€™t, even though they think they do. Once you get into it, the body responds quickly to SS work.

One of the pluses of doing a TTE FTP test over a ramp test is that physiological and mental boundaries are established.

If you can do 40min @ 100% FTP, then you know you can do 30min @ 90%.

My 4wk SS block progression:
100/135/170/200% TTE;
3x/2x/1x intervals/wk;
all @ 90% FTP.

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Thank you. A clear and exact answer, just what I was looking for.

  1. As an endurance athlete, Iā€™ll be pushing the curve right till about 1.5-2h.
  2. Then FTP, following Kolie Mooreā€™s principle of working at or just below FTP, starting 3x10 and see how I progress.
  3. How much focus would you put on doing VO2? I wonā€™t really need it that much on IM distance, should I just do a short block, then re-test FTP and go back to point 1 with new FTP?

Iā€™ve done this, am moving onto ā€˜something elseā€™ soon

Thatā€™s an option - where do the ā€˜sweet spot with sprintsā€™ type workouts come in though? (mentioned upthread somewhere). I was planning to go to say 3 x 20 SS with 10 sec sprints every 4 minutes as a starting point, then work up from there. Would this be a decent bridge between pure SS and the (nearly) threshold stuff?

Note @KlemenSj : Not necessarily asking you/putting you on the spot, just an approach that differed from what I was planning so thought Iā€™d get some opinions. :slight_smile:

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See below
image

I did something like these in an extensive aerobic block. Composition was 3x20 at 90% for 2:00 /115% for :30. The 20 minute blocks came out to 0.96IF. They are a good workout - they feel more like threshold, probably harder RPE than a steady 96% interval overall. They were a nice reminder of VO2 max power (even if brief).

And then is this gem:

It looks like a very bad thing to do to your body :smiley:

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Whoa :heart_eyes:

That looks horrible - kudos to the first person (with accurate FTP) to complete that!

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Just say no.

Telling that only two people have attempted, and the furthest only made it half way.

Question for thread participants who have been working through SST Progression: as some are already moving into the intensive or even VO2 realm do we continue the conversation/questions about those blocks in this thread, or do we start another one and link to it?

I have found the discussion in here around the science, but also how to build the workouts and measure the effectiveness incredibly helpful, and so would love to keep the convo going, but dont want to pollute SST progression for other readers or people looking for info. Thoughts?

Iā€™m doing my over/unders in my intensive block. Good prep for VO2MAX coming as well.

I progressed a bit too aggressively, however. I did 2x20 as 2:00 @ 92% - 30s at 115% last week (all standard mode so these were rough targets). Got through it well.

This week I tried 2x26 as 2:30 @93% - 45s at 115%. I just couldnā€™t clear lactate quickly enough to complete it. Got through the first set with two back pedals. Got through three intervals of the second, took a 9:00 Z2 break then did the last two. Overall more TiZ, but broken upā€¦

I think I shouldā€™ve just done a 3x15 or similar instead of the jump I tried. Other option would seem to be a 3:00 or longer under with the 45s over to keep the ratio the same as what I succeeded with the prior week. Hard to tell too as I have extracurriculars affecting my training right now too.

Ah well, at least I make these mistakes on myself first! Iā€™d be interested in how others structure this type of progression if anyone wants to share.

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Great workout!

Do you do this on the trainer without ERG?

I believe that over/unders with ERG a is a lot more easier because your muscles dont have to ensure you drop lower than 92%. I will try over/unders in Slope mode so i have to control the drops more by myself.

Sounds like a challenge! :crazy_face:

Butā€¦itā€™ll probably be summer by the time I get around to it. Shoot me a reminder.

:

edit: bah! A sneaky kudos pirate stole my thunder!

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I am using erg less and less these days. I do most of my quality sessions in standard mode. Iā€™ve found this is forcing me to work at some different cadences, whereas in erg, I can sit at 98-100rpm. Instead I have to change my cadence a bit and work at 92 to get close to a target power with my gearing. Feels more real to meā€¦ but on the days where I want to totally zone out, Iā€™ll still punch in erg mode.

Can you post pic (TR workout screen) of this, having a hard time visualizing what it actually works out to

Success:

Not success:

Iā€™m a bit embarrassed by the ā€œprogression.ā€ One of those things when I drew it up, I even thought, ā€œThis is too much too soonā€ā€¦ and then plowed ahead with it anywayā€¦ :confounded: I meanā€¦ .84 IF to .90 IF in a 90min workoutā€¦ dumbā€¦

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This is helpful though for a visual thanks.

This seems like a good one for the progression. My previous SS progression block included some over-unders, but they were a little bit less intensity (2 x 20min with 2min @ 90%, then 30s at 110%). I was planning on doing more than 2 x 20 since I had progressed time to 100min+, but it did the job and went pretty well

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Thatā€™s essentially my first one, but with a little less intensity. The biggest issue with my second workout was (I think) increasing the ā€œoverā€ by 50% but raising the ā€œunderā€ by only 25% while also adding 12min TiZā€¦

Only other difference is Iā€™ve front loaded some additional Z2 time in both.

Iā€™ve got an idea for a smoother progression which Iā€™ll try next week and see how it goes.