I think you’d get more feedback and a more focused discussion on those challenges by starting another thread.
(Note that I’m not passive-aggressively kicking you out… just offering a hopefully-helpful thought.)
Gotcha. I think you’re pretty early on in your development so the odds are really good you need further aerobic development and are limited by VO2max. Again, guessing a little bit here, but it’s an educated one. If you are getting dropped by different categories in different ways, that generally means you just don’t have the overall fitness you need quite yet. The good news is, that’s a common thing and any coach worth their salt will be able to help you improve within the bounds of your genetic capabilities! Hope this works out for you, and keep us posted!
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Okay, nice confidence builder after having to cut it on Monday. Was feeling good so I bumped it up on the last section. I quite like this style of mixed intensities for sweetspot work: the lower intensity parts make me focus on relaxing and riding easy even at a hard intensity. And the highest intensities are higher than I typically ride for sweetspot. It also breaks up the monotony, which is definitely an issue I have when staring at blue bars.
Not exactly sure yet where I’ll go for Saturday’s workout. In my plan, I was doing 4x25, but that was with the assumption I’d gotten to 90 min TiZ, which I have not.
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Only thing I don’t really like with undulating efforts like that is that it makes it harder to compare heartrate of the first half with the second half of block like that.
Why not just give it a go at a moderate sweetspor effort and see where you land?
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I think he explained why he liked it in this post. No harm to do what you like… “all roads lead to Rome.”
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So would doing hard start sweet spot and threshold efforts be worthwhile for that as well or does it need to be pure VO2max?
Right now as its off season and I’m ~5 months away from any racing am focused on sustained power, flat intervals like Log In to TrainerRoad
But wondering if as I approach spring I should start swapping SS and Threshold workouts for hard start SS and Threshold like Log In to TrainerRoad and Log In to TrainerRoad
Hard start threshold/SST isn’t going to make a difference. I give those generally as race prep stuff. Physiologically there’s not much difference: it’s still endurance training below threshold and you need VO2 work. VO2 work is not just “ride some in zone 5”.
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Okay maybe I won’t bother with them at all then as I expect they would add a fair bit to my fatigue.
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I replied to you because your statement about moving to VO2 following a SweetSpot block got me thinking. I’m currently in my SweetSpot block and will finish with 90 min time in zone (per workout) by the end. My A even is in May that’s a weekend of crits (3 crits in 3 days). 60 minutes being the longest.
With that in mind, and your advice to do a VO2 block before Threshold. Is like middle of January to early for the VO2 block? The reason I’m considering it there is due to work being really light right now around the holidays and I can get a good three week block of training while work is easy. Come February and March work picks up again which just means it’s more time on my feet at work and I might not be as fresh for the hard VO2 work. But I don’t know if Jan is too early.
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What about of doing them (VO2 + Threshold) mixed, instead of a block?
Something like: 1 Vo2 + 1 Threshold progression per week, fill the rest with endurance and group rides totaling 10/12hrs (500/600TSS). Is that a good approach for, I’d say, 6 weeks prior peak?
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i think a lot of us need to uncouple the idea of vo2 being associated with race prep. vo2 is something to do when it’s needed, I’m doing a vo2 block in January after finishing my sweet spot block because it’ll be the thing I need. I know guys who recently finished vo2 blocks prescribed by their coach (same coach, two different athletes), so if your needs involve raising your ftp ceiling, then a vo2 block is appropriate anytime
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Yea, I will admit that I’ve fallen into that trap of thinking. And it’s been quite some time since I’ve done a dedicated VO2 block (April 2023). So I think it’s appropriate. And from experience, my best season FTP-wise and results wise was coming after a February VO2 block. Now obviously that could be a ton of other factors, but I do remember feeling like I was flying coming into the season.
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Which is TR approach for Sustained Power, basically.
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and what would be a block, 4 weeks with 3x1 approach and 2 HIIT weekly?
I don’t think I can handle more than 2 HIIT, physically and mentally. Sometimes I just want to go outside and ride.
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But how do you know at what progression to start? Do you start at something that is ‘easy’ to achieve? Or start at upper of abilities?
Because for me. I can already ride 1x80min at 92-93% with limited cardiac drift. I even can go longer (but I was at the top of Ventop so…). Is the focus on weekly TIZ at SST maybe the goal and try to increase that weekly time. Or should I focus on working towards 1x120min?
I end my SST progression when I get to 90 min TiZ. I race 45 min CX and crits up to 60 min. So 90 minutes of SweetSpot is enough. I would imagine if you’re doing longer races then more time at SweetSpot would probably benefit you.
Yes, I do long granfondo’s or zwift stage races. But I think (or maybe I just have to test it) I could already do 120min at SST? 90% I am almost sure off…So maybe should I start a treshold progression? But I am the kind of tempo rider that is very good at tempo/SST but give me 10-20min at treshold or a little above I struggle 
My biggest gains came from doing 3 weeks of 3 workouts per week. So 9 total workouts. It was brutal and the hardest training block I’ve ever done. But like I said, I had huge gains and came into that race season flying and had the best results I’ve ever had.
Very little riding outside the VO2 workouts, a short recovery spin on off days. Lots of food. Lots of sleep. That’s why I want to do this block when my work is easy, because I needed all the recovery I could get.
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My plan is 3 blocks of 4 weeks, 3 hard 1 recovery:
1 (started 2 weeks ago), focus in endurance and some SST/tempo, nothing too much structured.
2 tempo progression to finish in 1x60min +/-90%
3 would be 1 vo2 (5x3 > 6x3 > 5>4) and 1 Threshold (2x20 > 3x15 > 3x20)
This would end in Feb 11 (hard of the winter). From this point I’ll measure where I’m and see where I need to go (improve/specificity), TiZ, FTP, vo2, etc.
edited: I don’t have any particular race in mind, but I believe the focus would be in June a 2,5hr road race. Not mountain, but hilly.
Our group ride - well below spicy - starts when the snow melts, basically. Late April. It’s on wednesday and it ranges from 2-3 hours of regretting why am I doing this? 
If I have a goal, would be being in shape for our rides.
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I’m not the expert, so I think there are more experienced people here. But I’d say if you’re doing 4 hour Fondos, I would personally want probably 120 minutes of time in zone. But I’m not sure I’d go much more than that. I will admit that I don’t have experience with that much SweetSpot though. The longest workout I’ve done is 2x50 a few years ago.
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