Agree, I’m the same
Agreed. Quad pain has significantly decreased since regular weight training. The first limiting factor to kick in now is cardio-vascular (i.e. breathing!) rather than leg-muscle stress. Also a significant reduction of DOMs and post-ride leg cramp.
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I too have been struggling with quad fatigue. I wasn’t sure what was happening but after reading your post, I think this might be what I am experiencing. I have been lifting consistently since September and I am starting to think it is time to stop now that my workouts and outdoor rides are picking up in intensity. I know I should switch to maintenance but I worry that will even be too much.
Anybody got experience doing plyometrics with strength training?
This last block I’ve done some different box jumps and speed squats before the main strength session mostly to just try something new. I feel like I have more snap on the over parts of over-unders now but I could be imagining it. Haven’t tested my sprint.
I have worked plyo into my training for a few years now, introducing it as I reduce volume.
I tend to use depth broad jumps, isolating my legs by crossing hands over shoulders. I alternate between single and two leg, with a focus on minimising ground contact time and controlling the landing.
At the time I made that decision, I think I did it because of the evidence base behind broad jumps, the ease of scaling (just jump further) and the reduction in risk from failure if fatigued.
I’ve found if I do them before my main lifts there is a noticeable strength impact, so to avoid injury squatting I do them second.
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I’m hoping those with more of an understanding of the science can help me out here…
I am on a 12 week strength and conditioning plan to try and create a more resilient body. I have gone from a MV plan to LV to accomodate 2 days of gym work and everyday life. With work, family, rest, eating, sleep etc. the best way for me to fit these in is as follows:
Mon - rest
Tues - 7am gym, 3pm TR workout
Wed - rest
Thurs - 7am gym, 3pm TR workout
Fri - rest
Sat - TR workout
Sun - rest/Z2 outside if I can
I know that the better structure would be to cycle and then lift on those weekdays I am in the gym but because of gym busy-ness it’s really tricky. In addition, I find this way round easier mentally, it means I am doing the work I am allocated and finally, right now my priority is addressing body issues with gym work and not cycling (which I am happy to maintain during this period).
There is a lot of talk about optimisation/optimal alongside consistency so really i’m just interested in knowing how detrimental is cycling after lifting (6-7 hours)? If we are talking marginal gains I am fine with that, if we are talking getting 75% benefit rather than 100 I am fine with that but if it’s more significant maybe I need to rethink.
Hopeful and thankful for any insight
The signals for the two different types of work is different. Lifting/strength work increases mTor, and endurance training increases AmpK. AmpK will inhibit mTor, so optimally one does endurance first and strength after 2-3 hrs. Mtor is active for over 12 hrs, so if you ride after you lift, you may be shutting of mTor prematurely.
That’s the science.
Studies have shown that if you ride right after lifting, you will make strength gains and continue to improve in the endurance sphere.
Personally, I would do as you are.
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I generally ride then lift, in usually the same workout. Or lift on its own.
Just whatever works best time wise I think, optimal might not be optimal for you but I still think it’s better to do some s&c rather than worry toooooo much about the minutiae.
I think it’s in the area of marginal gains, and for most of us it doesn’t matter that much.
Thank you both very much. Good to know gains will still be made in both spheres even if i’m leaving a little on the table. I can live with that in the spirit of getting the work done. In the future if life permits I can look to optimise.
Cheers
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I gave up worrying about it and mix and match my strength and endurance sessions. Honestly at the level we’re at it doesn’t really matter.
Have made very satisfactory progress in both my lifting and endurance (running and cycling). Mentally I’m in a wonderful place, enjoying all the variety in my workouts.
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Yep. If I don’t have an important bike session before or soon after then I’ll push the weights a bit. If I have an event or big ride planned I swap back squats for Overhead squats or something like that and just enjoy a quicker /easier session.
Completely agree. Worrying about which to do first is just one more obstacle in the way of me getting the sessions done which is priority.
It’s similar for me when integrating some yoga or stretching. Sometimes I might do a 10 minute yoga workout. Another day I might be in the mood for 20-30
Perfect is the enemy of the good as they say
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The reality is - if your strength is impacting your bike sessions: you’ll know about it, and you won’t need to ask the question. If you don’t find yourself forced into the choice you aren’t training near your capacity and can crack on and enjoy it.
When you do start to find that you are struggling on the bike as a result, there are often quite simple solutions - in order of preference:
Eat more
Periodise better
Rearrange the timing of your sessions
Change the kind of strength training
Reduce the strength volume
Reduce the strength intensity
Reduce the bike volume / intensity
Where you decide to land on this will end up depending upon your priority.
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Yes, absolutely.
Try things, see how they work for you, change what needs to be changed. EAT MORE 
I’d be grateful for some advice. I started a block of hypertrophy training in January (3/4x8-12 reps of various basic lifts) and I plateaued really quickly. I’m still on baby weights. It’s really frustrating and also tiring me out for cycling training. Is this normal for hypertrophy training? I’m eating protein but maybe not enough. I get a fortnightly veg box delivery and once I’ve eaten all the enormous mounds of cabbage that they deliver at this time of the year there’s not much space left over for anything else. Any ideas how I can get more protein?
Shakes, eggs, yoghurt, cottage cheese, soya (if you’re vegetarian)
Beef, chicken etc if you eat meat. If you’re vegan then it’s harder but you don’t need ‘that’ much protein as an endurance athlete compared to a bodybuilder. I have around 1.5g per kg BW up to 2.0 depending on what’s in the fridge.
If you’ve stalled, you need to address how often you’re lifting weights (2x per week or less will yield slow results) or if your cycling is hindering gym work. If it is, and you’re a cyclist predominantly then I wouldn’t be that bothered. Concentrate on the bike stuff.
Change your programme, use different exercises, rep schemes etc.
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I would also pay attention are you getting enough overall calories, if you’re filling your stomach with cabbage you might be undefueled and extra protein won’t help there.
If you’re underrecovering first thing I would add is more carbs.
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If you can do whey protein isolate it can be pretty easy to get a lot of protein. Two scoops of the one I use is 50g of protein so it makes hitting your targets a lot easier.
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Haha I don’t just eat cabbage! It just sometimes feels that way when there’s savoy cabbage and kale in the box week after week
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Thanks I already put some in my breakfast oats but maybe I should try to add another scoop somewhere
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