I don’t see any “flex” there and you only quoted half of what I said. I don’t think pros are typically very reliable with medical or scientific information.
I have nothing against Jornet. He seems pretty reasonable in his approach which is definitely sugar and gels during events. I see that he tries to plant based and eat pretty clean in the rest of his life. I couldn’t find though where he has contributed to the body of sports performance and nutrition science. Mostly I see that he is a pro athlete, author and influencer doing his own one person experiments.
This is what he eats before an ultra:
I don’t know how he only starts with a slice of toast and carob cream for breakfast but I assume he’s fully carb loaded from the night before.
Thanks for posting this, wasn’t aware there were any concerns specific to maltodextrin in terms of impact on gut health (as opposed to general concerns about high sugar consumption and insulin resistance /diabetes which I agree isn’t really something for endurance athletes to worry about if just using sugar to fuel exercise). If the concern is specific to maltodextrin then is the simple solution to make your own mix using glucose and fructose instead of maltodextrin and fructose? I used to do this anyway, my understanding is that glucose and maltodextrin are pretty much interchangeable in terms of the mechanism by which they get from gut to blood sugar, main reason I thought for using maltodextrin is that it’s less sweet which makes it more palatable when fueling long rides. I have a pretty sweet tooth so may just revert to glucose!
Similar to others, I try to save the high sugar fueling for key harder or longer sessions and races anyway. Try and minimise sugar intake off the bike (or at least consume it at the end of a meal so it’s not going straight into the bloodstream), and fuel the shorter and easier sessions with more whole foods like dates, rice cakes, homemade flapjacks, malt loaf or bananas if they’re long enough to need fueling at all. Partly for dental health, partly for cost and hassle (gels and chews are expensive, homemade bottle mix is cheap but quite a lot more hassle getting out the door than just water and stuffing some food in my pockets).
Alright, was bored at work so I decided to read the article and reached a different, less dramatic, conclusion.
In short, maltodextrine does not “nuke” your gut biome. The research concludes that mdx(maltodextrine) increases reproduction of a specific strain of e.coli associated with crohns disease. This was found in isolation in petri dishes from extracted epithelial cells from the large intestine. If you get down to the discussion points at the end a couple things stand out to me. First, is that this experiment is in regard to a “western diet” they described as high sugar/high fat/low fibre so already terrible for the gut biome. Second and more important to the discussion here is that it is also in regards to an mdx rich diet (said specifically in the discussion which to me implies regular high doses) which the article references the use of artificial sweeteners such as equal or splenda where they say mdx is used as a bulking agent. They also conclude with the fact that although the particle strain of e. coli they were testing with is associated with crohns disease it’s presence does not necessarily cause crohns disease as there are other associated bacteria found to be present in those with crohns that they didn’t test for.
So my conclusion is that like just about everything moderation is key. Occasional use of maltodextrine for sport is not going to destroy your gut biome. Regular use of mdx and an unhealthy diet will. If you’re someone with a predisposition to crohns or likes artificial sweeteners and regularly uses them you may have something to be concerned about. Likewise if you’re someone who thinks they need a malto-mix calorie bottle for every time they swing a leg over the top tube that might be habit worth breaking. If someone has concerns beyond that then yes, just sticking with glucose and sucrose based sports food/drink was fine at least in regards to this specific study. But let’s be real and admit that it doesn’t mean simple sugars don’t increase colonies of other deleterious gut bacteria. It just wasn’t part of this study. A proper diet with quality proteins, healthy fats and high fiber from real food will do the best for your gut biome and just don’t overdo it on the junk food, sporty or otherwise.
Food additives commonly added to UPFs, including emulsifiers, sweeteners, colours, and microparticles and nanoparticles, have been shown in preclinical studies to affect the gut, including the microbiome, intestinal permeability and intestinal inflammation.
As we said in my HazMat Days. “Dose makes the Poison”
If you minimize UPF in your day to day diet and only consume it on training rides & races, the dose should be well below any known threshold that may lead to a negative impact.
Overthinking this is going to lead to analysis paralysis. Put in the work to tidy up the day to day diet (protein, starch, cooked veggies, raw veggies) and if you feel like you need to go farther, do so.
You started this thread with an article and a request for non-malto options which were provided by myself and others. There are plenty of simple, marginally UPF at least and minimally processed at most options to get calories in during exercise that don’t require maltodextrine. Likewise, it ultimately comes down to the ingredients and less the processing level as all these articles allude to. But it would seem you’ve gone beyond that to trying to enlighten us or scare us into sharing your distrust of maltodextrine and UPFs. You hit the google and found 5 more articles. The first one references the article you already posted. Second is a mouse study. Third is a abstract that lantiobiotics stating they could be both good and bad. Fourth is again mice and at best correlative to humans but not a human study and as such can only go so far. The fifth makes this good point in it’s conclusions: “Although a randomized controlled trial demonstrated that consumption of UPF resulted in increased energy intake and body weight, no studies have yet investigated the effect of UPFs, or their restriction, on gut health or disease.” Every article stated more study is necessary and I doubt they’re saying that just because it’s the science-y thing to say. Gut microbiome science is still very young and all it’s effects and relationships are still not well understood. I should mention gluten gets a similar treatment as it’s said that regardless of celiac or diagnosed intolerance everybody has an immune response to the current strains that are found in hybridized American wheat. It’s just a matter of how much, how bad and how it expresses. Yet if you want to see food additives check out the labels on gluten free equivalents. If you’re passionate about the effect of mdx on the gut of highly trained athletes who use it frequently I’d suggest getting in touch with a sports research lab at a university and request they do fecal and epithelial cell testing on groups who mdx regularly versus those who choose other modes of nutrition. I believe that would be more applicable to this discussion versus studies aimed at people who use sugar free alternatives regularly thinking they’re healthier than straight sugar in their coffee.
In my read of the initial article and how I summarized wasn’t meant to offend but it lead me to a measured response that says there is cause for concern but not alarm and the read I took of all the following articles posted leads me to the same conclusion which the articles themselves seem to reach. There is correlative data to be found but no causation yet between mdx and IBS/crohns (please pardon me for not wanting to put in the apostrophe each time.) Likewise all allude to cronic use, not exposure. Once again citing a bullet point from the 5th article you shared :“A causal role of food processing on disease risk is challenging to identify as the body of evidence, although large, is almost entirely from observational cohorts or case–control studies, many of which measured UPF exposure using dietary methodologies not validated for this purpose and few were adjusted for the known dietary risk factors for those diseases.”
I am in no way saying you are wrong for being concerned and taking up avoidance. That is your choice and there are options available to support your cycling nutrition as even you have found. Even more so if you have risk factors for crohns/IBS. But reading the same material I reached a different conclusion and it is unchanged from my opinion above. There is reason for concern, to pay attention and avoid when possible, but also to wait for more and better research with more conclusive results as the testing and analysis improves. My box of Maurten 160 will get used here and there and even though it’s the smallest box they sell it’ll probably still take a year or 2. But nothing presented was conclusive enough to convince me that occasional ingesting of maltodextrine for sport will do damage that a diet rich in fruits, roots, nuts and grains with healthy proteins can’t ameliorate.
I wish you nothing but luck and success in your nutritional and cycling endeavors. May the wind be always at your back, especially when KOM hunting.
I won’t reply in depth but I just thought it right to say thank you for your considered reply. I took have a box of Maurten bought on discount; I too won’t be throwing it away, but I might be more circumspect with the 5kg bag of mdx that’s sat in the cupboard.
Hi all,
This is subject is very timely. I just spent the past 20 minutes before reading this chat, researching bulk Maltodextrin and Electrolyte on Amazon. I’ve just started fueling “correctly” in the past couple of months and have gone through 4kgs of sugar/maltodextrin at 2-1 ratio. With a Sprinter’s Phenotype, I’ve been tested in a lab and my fatmax is a very poor 50/50. Prior to fueling “properly” I would always struggle on rides over 2 hours. This past weekend, I did the 4-hour Alpine Dam route near San Francisco and on the 3 main climbs of 18-ish minutes, I PR’d all 3 by roughly 10%. As someone in his mid-50’s, I’m also racing against the clock with a goal of 4 w/kg (currently at 3.2 with weight to lose). For fueling, I had a staggering 360 grams (@70kg) of sugar mix in 1 1/2 bottles (DIY cost of only $2.75). It’s super concentrated so I just sip frequently. After finishing the 1/2 bottle, I filled that with plain water and would rinse my mouth after each sip. Besides having energy to ride hard, I’m not ravenous when I get home and don’t need a 5 hour nap after emptying the fridge. Lastly, I just had my annual physical with blood work. While I didn’t tell my Dr my on-bike fueling, my blood work came back actually better than in the past. Definitely N=1. So far I haven’t had any GI issues and hope that continues. I’ll probably have another set of blood work done before the end of the year just to make sure I’m not doing any damage with so much sugar. Finally, off the bike, I try to keep a balanced diet with plenty of fiber. Plus I lowered my alcohol consumption by 80%. I’m happy with my results so far but am wary of all the sugar I’m consuming.
Happy to hear if there are better solutions (no pun intended), but at under $3 for 4 hours, that’s hard to beat.
Cheers
@Neuromancer Stacy Sims has spoken about this a lot as well on podcasts. To me it makes sense and I have switched (well that’s not true - I went from not fueling to fueling) to honey, maple, candied ginger for all riding. But I’m a middle of the pack 48 year old female not the tip of the tip of the spear - so if I’m losing any advantage by doing this it really doesn’t matter. Does it make a bit of difference? Who knows? I’m not doing any gut microbiome testing to find out. But I’m also one of those people that only uses glass storage containers, hates medications, goes barefoot outside on purpose… so this is right up my alley Maybe he and David Roche will consent to annual testing of all the biomarkers to get an n=2 study of the two different approaches to endurance mountain running. However, something else to consider. Riding at the level one does, presumably if you are using Maurten’s and TR… probably isn’t “healthy” either. I think sustained high levels of upper end endurance is pretty anti-evolutionary. Walking, sprinting, climbing, lifting, pulling… those are things humans were meant to do. Not 5x8 at FTP.
Maybe he and David Roche will consent to annual testing of all the biomarkers to get an n=2 study of the two different approaches to endurance mountain running. However, something else to consider. Riding at the level one does, presumably if you are using Maurten’s and TR… probably isn’t “healthy” either. I think sustained high levels of upper end endurance is pretty anti-evolutionary. Walking, sprinting, climbing, lifting, pulling… those are things humans were meant to do. Not 5x8 at FTP.