I hit my all-time peak FTP and 4.0wkg at the ripe old age of 47 last summer, after 6 years with TR.
There is a future out there 
Same here!
Same age, same peak w/kg, also hit it last summer, but after 3 years using TR. Still holding out hope for improving that this year …
No it doesn’t, unless you are doing threshold work. Then that 3.5% matters a lot. Regardless, TR does a disservice to themselves by fixating on FTP.
There are two issues with how they discuss FTP:
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they have their own definition of FTP that seems to vary based on the context of the conversation at a given time
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times when people are doing the right things and gaining fitness, but don’t increase their ramp max 1min power.
Both call into question the credibility of TR for understanding training principles and also for making people stronger. The product is pretty darn good. But they unnecessarily open themselves up for criticism by how they discuss FTP. Some of the things coming out on the podcast lately to justify how they use of the term FTP is really nonsensical too. It isn’t helping on point one above at least.
From the discussion by Nate above, it sounds like we are going from current:
scaling a max 1 min ramp effort to approximate FTP to then scale that to get proper training zones
To
Using data to predict a ramp score to scale that to FTP, to scale that to get proper training zones?
Why not simply skip the middle part (estimate 1 min max ramp power to estimate FTP to estimate to training zones) and just use training data to estimate training zones? If someone really needs to know their FTP estimate, you can give it to them. But the entire exercise to try and do gymnastics to get a number you’re gonna scale multiple times is just ass backwards. Maybe that’s how it’s being done. But it isn’t being conveyed that way.
haha, we’re wondering the same thing!
I’ve been focused on fat/weight-loss and just maintaining FTP - down 11-12lbs since early December just from counting calories and doing a high-volume plan - my fitness is definitely improving but I’m struggling to get through any VO2 workouts - just carrying too much fatigue - I can handle the TSS just not the IF above sweet-spot, especially indoors… Plan is to get within 5-lbs of my goal weight and then flip to focusing on FTP gains, mid-volume build/specialty, and eating for maintenance - let the last few lbs. come off as they will.
You can still eat ice-cream - it just needs to be a couple small spoonfuls, not a pint
This is how we started. The vast majority of athletes have problems with doing sustained all-out efforts, especially long ones like a 20-minute test. We have years and years of data on this.
We also know that the ramp tests calibrates people for their next workouts better than the 20 and 8-minute test based on the number of failures and “super pass” that happens with the 20/8 minute test relative to the ramp test.
With this same system, we can also predict your FTP at a future date based on your history and what you have planned.
Dude, I thought you were like 35! 
You’ve got great genetics and must use sun screen 
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Let me clear this up.
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We use your FTP number to properly calibrate your training. The goal is to get your next productive workouts at the right level per workout level.
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We display this in Adaptive Training with our level system. IE You can crank your Anaerobic up to 10 but not improve your threshold score. Our AI FTP Detection system also looks at everything you’ve done (indoor and outdoor) and not just 1 minute on the ramp test.
We do. I didn’t describe the whole system on the podcast. I was trying to illustrate how you train ML. Our system does not work the way you describe it does.
It was going to be out tomorrow but we have two issues we’re fixing.
- Athletes would have to do a workout before their ramp test to trigger the ML processing. We need to put more hooks in place to trigger the ML processing.
- The processing takes 20-30 seconds. We need to add feedback to the user for them to understand that it’s processing in the background and not broken.
Then there’s some testing of some performance improvements that need to happen. So I don’t like giving out timelines, but that’s what’s left to be done before it goes into early access.
Do I need to sign up for beta-testing for this one? Sorry if I missed it…
This sounds great! Coming to the end of a build block and next week is recovery week. Crossing fingers to see it before I am scheduled to ramp test!
We’ll post on the forum when it happens.
But you’ll need to turn on “Early Access” which is on the website here: Log In to TrainerRoad
HA, thanks for that. Yeah, I am just a bit behind Coach Chad for age and identify with quite a few of his life states and changes, but have WAY more hair 
Good genes (baby faced for many years), no booze or smokes, and finally got serious about sunscreen after college are all parts of it. 
Will this work without a scheduled ramp test?
I have a scheduled for a ramp test this weekend I’d love to skip :). It’d be nice to update my ftp using this when it is released instead of me guessing…
Perfect - already enabled that… got a ramp test in two weeks ----- or do I? ha ha.
Keep up the great work!
I’m going to do my favorite thing and talk about vision and unreleased product…
At first, you’ll have a ramp test. You can just put a ramp test on your calendar and click a button and get it.
In the future, we might just push it to you. So once you reach a certain threshold of improvement we’ll just notify you to update your levels. We think we could also show you progress towards that progression so you know where you’re at.
Something like 85% way to a new FTP, keep training!
We have some steps in between there that we’ve designed to make it easier. And the AI FTP Detection prompt that I talked about above is still in the ideation phase. So no promises.
You’ll have a new check box to check once this goes live.
lolol
The ramp test works great for some people, but not for me. A VO2 max interval at a certain prescribed % of my ramp test FTP will feel like sweet spot.
Xert also never worked for me, for all of the same reasons you have stated! (I feel very validated now, haha).
Trainerroad will probably do FTP estimation their own way. My guess is there will be a great deal of transparency about the feature via the podcast and blog and if it’s not right, it will evolve and get better.
Also, in the podcast Nate mentioned that after adding this feature, they are not getting rid of the testing protocols (ramp, 20 minute, 8 minute). I would love to not have to do another 20 minute test. 
If I feel the new feature is an accurate and timely FTP estimation, I’ll use it. If not I know the 20 min test is reliable for me.
Will it matter if i only train in ERG mode? Like, always?. I don’t know how any of this ML works, just curious whether that will make a difference.
I doubt trainer mode matters at all. The power you hold is what matters most.