[quote="mdlyons1980, post:69, topic:]I am training for a 40K TT in September, so I created a plan in plan builder (is this even the right thing to do anymore?), and I am personally surprised by the lack of sustained intervals that it has prescribed for me. When preparing for a 40K I would have expected at some point in the plan to have longer sustained threshold intervals (30 minutes, or even more) at some point in the plan, but even in the build and specialty phases there seems to be just 10 - 15 minute intervals and then some ramp intervals up to threshold during the specialty phase.
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You have a problem!! I am training for a 50m and 100m TT and Plan Builder decided I should have the 40K TT plan! Even using just the LV plan and planning to do longer rides and longer intervals off plan, all the sessions were threshold! So that got kicked into touch.
Try sustained power build LV (or even General Build LV) . I have just PB’d on a 25m TT, using that having had a really poor winter training, and supplementing the LV with 2x20s, 4x20, 2x30 SS threshold rides and 45-50 mile Z2/3 tempo rides on the TT bike outside.
I had Dollar Law scheduled in for today. I didn’t look at the train now page, pleased I didn’t as it may well have cost me precious time. I just know that I under-perform in the ramp tests, so I just upped the intensity by 5% and completed it. Those VO2 intervals are spaced far apart and you have plenty of recovery time in between. I don’t think you lost anything by doing Shortoff instead.
I’m not included in the AT Beta testers, but I have updated my plan to the latest release.
I have a new way of thinking about this. Because the plans are now too easy for me, I am being forced to use my brain!!! I now have to evaluate how I performed on previous workouts, and then try to select the workout that is best for me. In other words, until I have AT, I’m using MAT (manual adaptive training). I think it is a good exercise (pun not intended). It helps me become more familiar with how the progression levels work, and how to consider how hard the previous workout was. For example, yesterday I chose to ride Givens-3, because it matched the type of VO2 workout that the plan suggested, but it was at a level 5.5, as apposed to the 4.3 that was recommended. I was able to complete the workout, and felt relatively good (I mean, it is VO2 work), and was at the top end of the recommended power range on all the intervals (doing these outside these days). With this information, I am now going to follow the advice from the podcast, and look for a 5.8 level workout next week when my VO2 workout comes up again. If I find that it is a little too hard, I might chose to make smaller adjustments (going up maybe 0.2 instead of 0.3), or if I find that I can still complete the next workout relatively easily, than maybe I will try larger adjustments (like going up 0.4 instead of 0.3). All of this thinking makes me a more informed cyclist, and will make me for fully appreciate and understand what AT does when I get access to it.
This is spot on, I’m actually thinking a lot more about how I react to certain workouts now, it’s quite interesting and so far, I’ve been pretty accurate for a human…
I think users would be better served by doing a level bump and getting a bit more time in zone than doing an FTP bump. If you set your FTP to a point where these low progression level workouts are challenging, you probably aren’t working the intended zones.
I think I will just work out my own plan. Plan builder assigned mid volume, with 5 sessions a week which were Vo2, Over under, Threshold, Sweetspot, with one short endurance ride. Way too much intensity and not enough specificity in my opinion as the longest ss or threshold interval would be 12 - 15 minutes. I just came off the weekend where I did over unders, and threshold, had my recovery day, but this morning I could not stomach a vo2 session so I kicked it in to touch and did a longer endurance ride.
You approach sounds good. I tend to do at least one group ride a week which gets me miles and good intensity depending on which one I do. I think then if I have one or two more interval sessions like longer threshold, or a SS or Vo2 depending on how intense the group ride was and fill the rest with endurance on the TT bike, I should be able to manage that.
I’m curious how this happened. Did it just disappear at the time of the release of levels? I was also on a polarized plan at that point and my calendar didn’t change at all. Were you prompted to adjust to new plans or something? I had thought the polarized plans didn’t change at all, so it feels like a really strange bug to have seen a plan that wasn’t reworked completely disappear
Yeah, we don’t know the “how”. It was likely linked to the new plan rollout and whatever else is rolling around behind the scenes. Those that shared issues also shared that TR fixed their plans in very short order (around an hour or so from notification, IIRC).
Like anything in the tech industry, stuff can and will go wrong. We just need to make use of TR support, because they are interested in fixing our experience when things break. And from my experience and that shared on this forum, they are one of the fastest in getting people working again.
This isn’t fair (r.e. the meme posted above), and I hate that stuff like this is the default response to literally any constructive criticism of TR. It’s not unreasonable to have liked the old plans, and to ask to still have access to them.
Also: it’s definitely not unreasonable for the people who don’t have access to adaptive training yet (which is the majority of people afaik?) to have queries about the “difficulty” of the new plans.
It has to be taken in good humour - logically it (the meme / similar) doesn’t make any sense because they are not the same people
It’s very reasonable for one set of customers saying the plans are too hard and they have to adjust down and for an entirely different set of customers saying the new plans are too easy and they have to adjust up.
and clearly those who don’t have AT and are requesting access to the old plans as an interim measure were not the ones saying they were too hard previously.
yeah, I may just try grinding my progressions at the expense of FTP until I can reasonably believe I’ve earned that FTP. It’s kind of like a role-playing game.
and clearly those who don’t have AT and are requesting access to the old plans as an interim measure were not the ones saying they were too hard previously.
Yes, exactly this; I was very happy doing the old low volume plans and filling in a load of Z2 outside. It was never too much intensity. That’s why I’m worried about the “step down” in intensity in the new low volume plans; I don’t think it’s enough for me to progress.
I’m not saying the new plans aren’t good. I’m not saying TR shouldn’t offer them. I’m just asking them to keep the old plans as well.
A joke is a joke, is a joke. The best ones are often grounded in at least some level of reality, like this one.
TR got hammered for weeks, with thousands of posts claiming how hard and overly intense their plans were. We now get plans that seem “easier”, that TR claims to have better progression & compliance… and we get complaints that are 180* from the ones above (plans are too easy now).
It’s comical as a broad scenario. I think we should be able to see it no matter what views we have. The joke and my specific observation aren’t intended to really skewer anyone in particular, but just take note of something that is funny and full of irony.
Surely it’s obvious that these aren’t the same people though? I just think it’s ridiculous that people are being made fun of because they liked the old TR plans
Except TR literally could please everyone by keeping the old plans accessible, even if it was in some sort of separate archive page, which is all anyone wants.
We literally have no idea what they really have in mind. What seems easy from the outside, is often quite complex in reality.
Maybe that idea is a piece of cake, but maybe it would completely clash with the direction they are headed. We just don’t know. All we can do is make a suggestion by engaging with TR and see where it all goes.
You know you can copy/paste weeks of already-done plans from the calendar into future weeks, right? So any plan that has been done, including modifications you’ve made to them, can be done again, with a couple of minutes of effort. Maybe a minute or two more than getting them from an archive page.
