🎉 🎉 🎉 Introducing Adaptive Training! 🎉 🎉 🎉

[Nate_Pearson]

@RobClapham

But I am beginning to get a little bored with doing the same workouts and feel like, even though my FTP has gone up each time, the early progression V02 max workouts (30 secs, 60 secs) are too easy and I might be under-challenging myself early on) I wonder what AT will make of this. I know I could throw in a build to spice things up, but I’m pretty sure I heard @Nate_Pearson say in a podcast, if the gains keep coming keep repeating the base?

Will AT start throwing in harder workout variants each time I repeat a SSBMV2 block, knowing that I am getting very good at doing these types of workouts and could do with something to challenge me more? Can’t wait to find out.

If you’re marking the workouts with a low RPE and they are supposed to be a high RPE you will progress faster.

You can also use Workout Alternatives and try a “stretch” workout. That will also progress you more quickly.

[Nate_Pearson]

@3dflyer87

I do ~50% of my TR training with my Stages power meter on rollers (or outdoors) and ~50% on my Wahoo Kickr. They have a known 6% offset to one-another (Kickr reads ~6% higher).

Will AT attach your different specific sensors to different workouts to be able account for these offsets? This definitely becomes important with workouts like over/unders.

Thanks!

No, not right now. We’d need to record differences in different power meters and have someone type them in or something like that.

[Nate_Pearson]

@Chester_Grimpeur

So say I’m doing a plan and my weds workout is 1 hour but I have 90 mins on that day. Can I just use TrainNow and select a 90 min workout and then my plan will adapt?

Correct. Or you can use Workout Alternatives and select a 90 minute workout.

Workout Alternatives gives you a bit more fine grain control. It shows you 90 minute workouts at the same level and workout profile.

We think Workout Alternatives is the better option in this scenario.

[Nate_Pearson]

@Chester_Grimpeur

I think the point that hasn’t been answered is if this is going to be days, weeks, months, years!

Totally appreciate that you can’t give guarantees, but do you expect the majority of people to have access in days, weeks, months etc?

At the moment people know “how” you are going to roll it out… but not “when”.

Next people will probably get in this week depending on the PR status of the one above.

New features will come to EVERYONE in weeks, not months.

Of course, I could get burned by this statement if we have a very bad bug.

[Nate_Pearson]

@triggerdog

Thanks so much for the response Nate! Fascinated to see how it’s going to work and can’t wait.

Follow up question. How does AT response to you straight up manually deleting workouts from a plan. Would it try to replace it for you? And would it consider them as ‘failed’ rides if you just don’t do them?

Deleted workouts would be considered like time off or a skipped workout. So the next week would most likely get a bit easier.

[Nate_Pearson]

@pats

Hi @Nate_Pearson. I had a recent ramp test where I unfortunately lost power connection at the end. Not sure how much longer I would have been able to hold on but at that point 30sec-1min makes a huge difference
I did not accept the new suggested ftp, but will I be able to “uncheck” or delete workouts like this so that it’s not “calculated” towards other workouts in the adaptive training?
Ty

If it’s a ramp test it won’t have any impact.

If you “struggle/fail” in a workout due to a device issue there’s a survey option to say you had a device issue. That makes our ML ignore it.

[bobw]

Yesterday I had Kaiser+2 planned but subbed it for Kaiser-1, how would AT deal with that? I.e. still doing a workout in the same energy zone as that planned but either easier, as in this case, or harder?

[Nate_Pearson]

@zombo

Sorry if already answered, but for the post-workout RPE survey… in the scenario that we turn down the workout because it was far too difficult and made it do-able what should the grade be? Based on what we turned it down to, or based on the fact that we had to turn it down so that would put it in the “very hard/all out” category? What if we completely turn down a z5 ride to z2 making it essentially easy, is the right answer here to say it was an easy workout?

Based on what you actually did.

So in the Z5 to Z2 it would be an “easy” workout.

[Nate_Pearson]

@yajvans

Sorry if this question has been answered but are recovery weeks necessary when using the adaptive training feature? I hope adaptive training will be rolled out soon as I just want to enjoy riding my bike. I am someone who just uses my bike as a form of exercise and not really concerned about winning races. What I really want is to enjoy bike riding while getting faster at the same time. I am sure that there are several trainerroad users who are having similar goals.

I would suggest using Train Now for this scenario. Just ride how you feel and choose what workout looks interesting to you.

[jmdcovas]

Very exciting. I just got my new Kickr Core, can’t wait to get added to the Beta.

[Nate_Pearson]

@enki42

I hope the goal is for us to tell the app how much volume we have time for and the app can set the volume of the workouts. Add endurance to fill the unused time but mark it so it’s ready to know that workout can be skipped?

Edit - I should have read more before responding. Seems like that is the goal

But how much time is not equal to how much volume you should do.

IE I technically could ride 5 hours per day, every day, but I shouldn’t!

[Nate_Pearson]

@1coderyder

So I’m wondering if the AI will penalize me for bombing the cool downs at the end.

It will not. We ignore warm up/cool down.

[Nate_Pearson]

@timon

How cool is it for the CEO of a company to come on the forum regularly to answer questions, criticisms and expand on limitations/goals of the product. It’s not everywhere that happens, heck…maybe not anywhere.

Thanks! I think I might do my own post about how athletes want to be communicated to.

Half the people seem to like me being open with roadmap and priorities.

The other half see it as “teasing”, being dishonest, and need hard timelines.

[riku168]

Agree completely. Given the huge hype of the podcast, the rollout is a decided meh. More clarity on timelines would be very helpful. For such a data driven company TR really ought to be able to provide at least minimal reporting on numbers in the beta queue & daily movement. With slightly more effort it should be possible for TR to show people where they are in the queue, assuming they signed up to the beta with the same email address they normally use. If we are really talking months before the AT features are rolled out on a large scale to the willing beta testers, they should have just kept quite for awhile.

[enki42]

I realize that, but it gives the upper limit. For example Xert seems to think I should do 2-3 hour workouts when I have no time for that. I’m assuming I have no clue how much I should workout or what days I should but I do now when I’m free. But then I’m pretty sure you answered that you plan to have TR know how much of that free time it should take up.

[Nate_Pearson]

@LucasKun

I’m kind of laughing at reading about FTP again, as personally I’m now so much more interested to see my fine-grained relative fitness, to see the small steps in each category. FTP just became a whole lot less interesting to me, and that feel like a very good thing.

I do understand FTP is still a global gauge, and therefore very very telling. And that a FTP increase/decrease immediately corresponds with a total rescaling of all little bars. But the fine-grained energy system progression will be so much fun/motivating that FTP as a single number becomes less relevant, and I think that will be very good. You could even stabilize your FTP (which tends to happen at some point) and keep playing with the energy systems. The new approach has so much potential for fun and inspiration.

Yes, this is our exact experience too.

I think the old system of waiting 4-6 weeks between ramp tests can lead to a bit of anxiety.

“Am I more fit?”
“Will I perform on ramp test day?”

Now you really know where you stand at any time. And if you bomb your test that’s OK and the system will just keep you going.

You could even score the same result on the ramp test after 4 weeks BUT be doing much harder workouts and still progress in fitness.

[RobertSims]

@Nate_Pearson

It will not. We ignore warm up/cool down.

Does that include if the cool down is extended to do extra riding/endurance (or even extra intervals)?

[enki42]

I hope the complaining half is just the more vocal half. Easy to complain but hard to really think about what is happening. (Like my responses up above aren’t meant to complain as much as trying to suggest my thoughts even if they aren’t good)

[Nate_Pearson]

@tofel

Could someone of the beta group tell me what happens when I shorten the breaks between sets, will it register as pass, super pass or fail?

This would be a pass. If you stopped in the middle of the set for an extended duration it would be a struggle or fail.

[tnordberg]

@Nate_Pearson

I might pee 2x during Baxter and it still says it’s a pass.

That’s because you’re still a long distance triathlete at heart and never leave the bike to do so.