Hey. I’ve been cycling for nearly three years and prior to that I did powerlifting, weightlifting and strongman competitions. For around 15 years.
Without trying to overthink my training too much as I know it’s a long long game (I’m 32) I was wondering if I should focus on increasing my cadence or during specific sessions at least.
I do the most power (not the only metric, I know) when I do a natural and low cadence. My HR is lower and it feels easier. However I do race (crit, MTB, CX sometimes) and other riders do higher cadences and I know it’s good for responding to attacks etc.
If I did my efforts with >90-100rpm I know my power would be down but would it be worth it to see other improvements?
Or will it naturally increase over the years? Or am I destined to just have a lower RPM n general as I know everyone’s different and I doubt it’ll make or break my pro tour ambitions
Increasing cadence only results in lower power if you are shifting to an easier gear first. The goal of training to increase cadence should be to use it to increase the power you can put out in any gear, and your part of that will be to train to be able to accelerate in the same gear and hold that higher cadence for longer than is currently comfortable.
I’m a masher. I dealt with this dilemma 6 or so years ago…got pretty strong off newbie gains, good climbing power (on mtb), but I felt like I needed to work on increasing my cadence (holding it for longer) for climbing steeper stuff, with roots and the like. I did ok with this for a while, using an easier gear than I’d use if I was mashing. I actually got slower, but in retrospect, I never kept pushing the power with the increased cadence, I was just learning to spin.
Now, years later, my indoor cadence is normally up in the mid 80s, and my power is much higher overall. But, I still can’t hold the higher cadence for more than a few minutes comfortably, I’m running out of gears on my mtb on the flat (that 10-ring is a bugger over 20mph for me). And I put my cadence meter on my mtb for a few riides (usually stays on the trainer indoors), and my outside comfortable cadence is low 70s and I tend to climb in the 60s (I worked on my standing climbing a lot last year, and I’ve gotten strong at it, but probably use it too much now as a crutch with my low cadence). So anyway, I’m back to working on increasing my cadence and being able to hold it, but this time, I’m working on holding it at the top end. Granted, my situation is a little different, being limited on how high I can go with my chainring by the frame, too.
My main issue, I think, is that I neglect VO2 workouts. But, since my normal on the trainer is now like 83 rpm (for like 5 years now), I was sure I was up in that range on the mtb (I ride a fair amount on the road to get to nearby trails), but nope. And I can purposefully spin up and hold a higher cadence for a couple minutes, but as soon as I lose focus for a second, it just settles back to low 70s. It’s maddening.
Standing climbing is awesome when you get it. Great feeling when we hit a punchy climb and my buddy is shifting to spin and I shift the other way as I stand, and blow past him.
Does ERG mode encourage higher cadence? I ask seriously and I seem to have a higher cadence due to the training I’m doing, mostly in ERG, and often above 100rpm. I did a targeted cadence workout and survived (hard on the knees) so I can do lower cadence, but ERG seems to encourage it. Opinions?
I think so yes. I find ERG hard as I have to increase my RPM to hold power and that’s where I start to die off. I would prefer to just shift up a gear and mash it.
I try to do as much ERG and standard resistance training as I can in equal measures. And try to avoid the spiral of death.
Yeah, I do do vo2 but as I say I could maybe try by not looking at watts for a few sessions and just target cadence or even max HR and then see what happens. Everyone is always sad when the Watts are down though right.
Yeah, right. I have found myself watching my cadence a lot more partly because I did develop a rather high cadence when I started riding Zwift. I blamed it on the trainer I had which had a real flywheel (and a hell of a lot of noise too) and the way that it ‘felt’. It seemed to feel better on the big ring and with a high cadence, rather than on the small ring. I think it was the inertia that seemed to carry me over the start of higher intervals and keeping a higher cadence accentuated that feeling. Riding outside, I was usually in the 110 to 125 cadence, and chewing myself up doing it.
I also drew the attention of ‘The Local Ride Expert’ who spent a lot of time ‘coaching me’ and ripping my riding style apart. Nice butt head, and I’ve heard most groups have them? PASS!
Back to it: I rode Zwift Academy(?) earlier, and they had intervals that had lower cadences. I tend to avoid those like the plague (I even copied one set of lower cadence training and removed the cadence commands) but told myself to ride them as part of the series (for credit/food pellets) and didn’t find them to be that hard with my knees. So now to keep in the present and deliberately try to lower my cadence. (Keep thinking ERG MODE means the same output no matter how fast I don’t pedal?)
So ride more ERG on a physical flywheel? I’m 60+ and I’ve had multiple knee surgeries. As you get older you might welcome higher cadence over stomping up a hill. If you can ‘leg press your way up a climb’, enjoy the shit out of it. Some of us can’t do that anymore. Ride on!
My interval cadence (and general) fell about 6 years ago. I would be relatively easily 90rpm + for a session and constant outdoors rides. I don’t know whether or not it coincides with me getting a SMART trainer or my bowel cancer op though but for a couple of years after I was actually more powerful at a lower cadence and I’m still faster at the moment!
Sort-of a spinner here. Routinely hitting 101-105rpm (sometimes higher) as average interval cadence for tempo, sweetspot, & threshold, & >100 for the whole workout. This is on outdoor workouts. Z2 is still mid-to-high 90s, haven’t done VO2 or higher for ages. I think what’s changed is that I did three blocks back-to-back of Traditional Base 1 MV with strength training. AI-derived FTP did drop during those three months. Probably de-trained type-two muscle fibres -» less glycolytic contribution. But two more months later, FTP is back to what it was before the 3× TB1 period.
Basically I feel like my previously torquey diesel was replaced with a free-revving twin-rotor petrol, because now, by comparison I tend to feel a bit bogged down in threshold intervals when cadence drops below 90-ish rpm, & the remedy is to drop a gear, get back up to ~115rpm & change up again.
For reference, my height is 174cm, cranks are 165mm, so probably subtract 5rpm to compare the numbers to the 172.5s that the manufacturers would prescibe to me.
I have a similar situation where I used to ride a bunch then lifted weights 5-6 days a week for almost 10 years and then switched and got back into riding a few years ago. I never did any powerlifting / strength competitions but was very consistent with lifting as we have a home gym. Plus my wife and I would do it together which helped.
When I got back into riding I noticed my cadence wanted to hover around the 75-80ish range but my power numbers were fairly good from all the lifting. The problem was I needed to build the engine. Plus my understanding is when putting out higher watts at a lower cadence your legs will fatigue much quicker than if you can maintain a higher cadence. I have focused on increasing my cadence this last year and have found this to be true. I am now able to hold harder intervals at higher power numbers for much longer if my cadence is around 90.
It might be helpful to focus on high spin drills at low power plus 1 legged spinning to help smooth out and increase your cadence. Shorter cranks will also help which sounds like you already have.
Cool, thanks. Glad to hear it’s not just me. I do as much of my workouts as I can bare at a higher cadence then sometimes submit and revert to a lower one.
Guess it’s just a long game! I like to see my avg cadence come up just as much as my watts so least there’s that bit of enjoyment
Yeah, right. I have found myself watching my cadence a lot more partly because I did develop a rather high cadence when I started riding Zwift. I blamed it on the trainer I had which had a real flywheel (and a hell of a lot of noise too) and the way that it ‘felt’. It seemed to feel better on the big ring and with a high cadence, rather than on the small ring. I think it was the inertia that seemed to carry me over the start of higher intervals and keeping a higher cadence accentuated that feeling. Riding outside, I was usually in the 110 to 125 cadence, and chewing myself up doing it. 
Sort-of a spinner here. Routinely hitting 101-105rpm (sometimes higher) as average interval cadence for tempo, sweetspot, & threshold, & >100 for the whole workout. This is on outdoor workouts. Z2 is still mid-to-high 90s, haven’t done VO2 or higher for ages. I think what’s changed is that I did three blocks back-to-back of