Im bugging out a bit... should I be? (Solved)

[DustinMcQuate]

Hello All-
Im new to any sort of structured training or “racing”.

I signed up for 1 lap of the Firecracker50 here in Breckenridge so have committed to 25 miles & approx 3600’ of climbing on July 4.

I started my Cross Country Marathon plan on April 9. Im 55 so I believe that I get “masters” recommendations.

I start my “specialty” phase tomorrow after having completed my base and build phases.

Ive had a tech issue, starting 5/21, where it seemed like my progression levels didnt change for weeks. I notified TR and they agreed that my progression levels didnt seem to be changing properly.

My question, cause for bugging out, is:
I dont believe that my plan has done more than one adaptation since I started on April 9. Is that normal?
I find the “VO2 max” workouts to be hard and the “endurance” days to be slightly challenging. My VO2 max progression level has changed but my endurance progression level barely changes with my endurance rides. Ive had virtually no “tempo”, “sweet spot” or “threshold” labelled rides so far and those progression levels havent changed much at all.
I have no tempo or sweet spot rides in my specialty phase but there are a couple of threshold rides coming up.

Ive also had no scheduled workouts last more than 60 minutes (and none of the upcoming rides are over 60 minutes) while I expect the race to take me 3:30. I understand that with correct training I dont need to have training rides as long as the race, but should some of my worouts be longer than 60 minutes?

I did an outside ride yesterday that Ive done in past seasons and I honestly didnt feel noticeably stronger or have more cardio.

The above, combined with not hearing that my issue is resolved, has me losing confidence in the plan. Have I lost weeks where my workouts should be adapting up (or down)? Do I just need to settle down and trust TR is working correctly or does something seem off?

Any help would be appreciated–
Thanks a bunch!

[vbx2010]

@DustinMcQuate

I understand that with correct training I dont need to have training rides as long as the race, but should some of my worouts be longer than 60 minutes?

this gets asked a lot here, and the answer is no. the plan will give you workouts based on the schedule you said you could do (x amount of hours per week).

[DustinMcQuate]

Hmm… that makes sense.
So I assume if I can do more hours then my workouts will stay at 4/ week, but they may be longer? If that is the case, then I will try to figure out how to add more hours… and hope my plan “adapts” accordingly.

[DustinMcQuate]

Also, do you by chance know… if I manually increase the duration of the workout will the intensity be reduced accordingly?
Essentially, I want to tell TR that I have more time to train and I would like that extra time to be utilized and scheduled by TR as they best see fit.
Im concerned that if I manually alter the duration of a specific workout (or week of workouts) I will screw up the plan that TR is pushing to me.

Thanks!

[stickmandj]

You could look for an alternate with a longer duration than the scheduled workout but with a similar progression level. That should keep it as manageable as intended while giving you more time in the saddle.

[NigelTufnel11]

This might be of some help:

https://support.trainerroad.com/hc/en-us/articles/360038029531-How-to-Change-your-Training-Plan-Volume

Basically, adjust the days and amount of time you can train each day (along with how aggressive you want the plan to be), and then let TR do its thing just keep in mind that just because you say that you can train 5 hours a day, 7 days a week, TR won’t actually give you that much volume unless it ‘feels’ confident that you can actually do it. (That is, you’ll be doing a lot less volume, but TR will have more flexibility in how it sets up your schedule.)

So, look at the plan calculator and just be realistic.

[DustinMcQuate]

Thanks @stickmandj!
Am I correct that when you say “similar progression level” you mean, for example “Endurance 2.0”?

[DustinMcQuate]

Thanks @NigelTufnel11
I checked my training plan volume and Im on the recommended plan: 4 days/ week with 2 of them being intense workouts.
Are you saying that I can adjust each workout to say “2 hour” workouts and TR will make a call whether I can handle that and if I cannot it will simply keep me at my current workout duration of 60 mins (or adjust the workout somewhere in between 1 and 2 hours)?

Perhaps Im overthinking this… it’s just that since I have had only 1 adaptation/ change since starting in early April (and due to support saying that they saw an issue) I am concerned that the AI adjustments arent working. Perhaps the AI suggestions are so on point that they dont need to adapt?

[NigelTufnel11]

You don’t actually change the workout. You adjust your plan to say that you have 2 hours ‘available’. From there, TR might start giving you 2 hour workouts,if it feels you can handle them, or you might get something shorter, if it feels you can’t. What it will do is not give you any workouts longer than 2 hours.

In this process you are making changes to the base parameters that TR uses to create your plan, not modifying individual workouts within a created plan.

[stickmandj]

Yes, that’s exactly what I mean. if you are currently assigned an endurance level 2.0 for 1 hour but want to ride for 2 hours then pick an alternate with a duration of 2 hours at level 2.0

[vbx2010]

You’re WAY overthinking this.

[Caro.Gomez-Villafane]

Hey @DustinMcQuate

First things first, I’ve escalated your case so we can get a quicker answer as to what may be happening here.

I took a look at your Calendar and you have been progressing in your training, it’s just for whatever reason the Threshold workouts have remained at the same level.

Moving forward I like the suggestions you’re receiving! Let’s update your plan by using the Check Volume feature: How to Change your Training Plan Volume.

You’ll see that you can change your desired duration on the Schedule tab:

Once you update it, let’s me know as I want to see what it gives you!

Lastly, here is more info about the alternates everyone is talking about: How to use Workout Alternates

These are super useful when you want to bump the Workout Level of a ride and stay within the same energy systems scheduled for the day!

---

While the plan exercises the energy systems needed for your event, we recommend you do throw in a few longer outside rides to test gear, nutrition, hydration, etc…

Here is a good article with tips: Training for a Century: Be Prepared for Your First 100 Mile Ride

Note: since you’re close to your event, I would probably throw in 1-2 longer outside rides in these next two weeks so that you stay fresh closer to your event. You can swap out your Endurance rides on Thursdays or your Saturday Threshold workouts and take it easy on Sunday.

You can Right Click on the workouts and change it to a Solo Ride:

How to Add Group and Solo Rides to your Training Plan

[DustinMcQuate]

@Caro.Gomez-Villafane Thanks for the reply!

After making this post, I did also email TR customer support again since I hadnt heard from them for several days. (I dont know if you all are in the same department, but I last heard from Scott and the case number is 316965: https://support.trainerroad.com/hc/en-us/requests/316965)

My primary concern, and reason for me contacting support on 5/21 and starting this thread, is ensuring that my plan is adapting currently scheduled workouts accordingly. Support suggested, like you, that my workouts were not adapting much and my progression levels werent advancing much.

I am trying to get confirmation from TR that my workouts and progression levels are either adapting correctly or they are not. And if they are not, to please get this remedied asap. I do not know how much adaptation should be happening in my plan. As far as I recall, I have only once seen TR suggest an adaptation to the existing workouts and not state “no adaptations required”. I dont know if this is normal or not.

Because I have low confidence that TR is working as planned, given the response from email support as well as you, I was thinking that perhaps I should add more volume if TR is not adapting workouts appropriately.

Having said that, if adding more volume will help my training (whether TR is working properly or not) I am able to do so. I dont necessarily want to make manual changes to specific workouts, rather, I would like to “tell” TR that I can do longer workouts.

Of the suggestions that I have received, @NigelTufnel11 's suggestion seems to be most on track with what I am trying to accomplish.

But again, I mostly want to confirm that TR is or is not working properly for me and scheduling accurate workouts.

Should I wait to hear from email support before making any manual changes to my plan?

Thanks again for your assistance!

[Caro.Gomez-Villafane]

Hey @DustinMcQuate

I heard back from the devs, and I’ll update your ticket with the same info so we’re all on the same page! (Our departments are all intertwined).

Good news, your plan has been on the right track all along! Let me explain:

• Your plan was set to 1 hr / 1 hr / 45 min / 1 hr, which is capping your durations.
• You have auto-accept adaptations enabled, so your plan has been adapting. This is the reason you might not have seen them.
• TrainerRoad now looks beyond just Workout Levels, factoring in your fitness, recent training, and overall trends to pick the right workout for you that day. So, it just so happens that the same workout (Threshold in specific) kept being recommended because it technically is the “best” workout.
• Looks like you’re due for an AI FTP Detection if you’d like to update it. You can go to Account>>click on the red button “Detect my FTP”. If your FTP has increased, this is definitely a sign that you are getting fitter.
• Another sign I am also seeing is that you mentioned the interval work is feeling hard, and the endurance is slightly challenging. This is exactly what we’d expect out of these workouts. If all was feeling easy, then I would be a little concerned

Now, if you’d still like to change the volume, you can use the Check Volume feature and adjust your training time. Or you can leave things are they are and throw in a few outside rides before your Event.

Let me know if you have questions!!