Triathlete here. My max bike CTL was 90 building up for Challenge Roth back in 2017.
I was training around 16h per week with the bike accounting for 60 to 65% of that figure.
My FTP was the highest I ever recorded being around 4w/kg at 51 years old.
However, I found that it plateaued when I reached 65 CTL but the aditional stress up to 90 was crucial to make my back half of the long rides quite managable. In the race I even negative splitted the second half by more than 10 watts.
It is not all about FTP or CTL as someone pointed before.
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If you want to work our your optimal CTL ramp rate, or today’s TSS based on CTL/ATL/TSB try our little handy CTL calculator // it might help someone // link is FFT TSS & CTL Ramp Rate Planner - Google Sheets
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Hey Alex, very cool calculator! Comment: ATL / cell F8 appears to be locked, at least for me. Perhaps there could be a color key indicating which cells are editable?
Cheers!
[ryanhnelson] Hey Sorry, my mistake, try now, I unlocked it; following your suggestion, everything in orange is now editable
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138 is insanely high. that said, if he could tolerate it and had the time, volume works wonders. BUT most athletes race really well 70-80. I see people enjoying hitting 90-100 but then get super tired after…almost a bit too tired because they haven’t done that often enough.
personally i push high CTL because I love riding more than training; racing is an afterthought for me.
currently at 150, highest i’ve been in a long time, just before my rest week starts on sunday!
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What I learned from my high CTL experiment is that I can tolerate high volume and high ramp rates, I didn’t get ill or injured. The TSB metrics also predicted pretty well when I was cooked, I remember going on a couple of Sunday group rides even though I had already done enough for the week, and each of them turned out horrible, lol. However, at the peak of my plan, I had a couple of near 1000 TSS weeks, and I found it stressful to fit all those hours in (I work full time). Also, because I did most of it with ‘just riding’, I felt I lacked in specific race fitness.
So the next year, I changed it up completely and only did ‘quality’ sessions (with a TR plan). My CTL peaked at about 60, I lost a bit of power (I think, didn’t have a PM the year before), and I had my worst race season yet, lol.
So this year I was going for a mixed approach (hey, its all a learning experience!), but the corona virus lockdown has thrown that out a bit.
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Dude! It is hard not to get caught up in some of these metrics looking at your PMC/dashboard. Your point about many racing well around 80 is valid. Do you see any correlation in your athletes to peak CTL and say FTP or hour power etc…???
great Q, there is a chart in WKO that you Can use, but it’s a bit jumbled in my mind. Funny timing, I am about to post a peaking video on the youtube page and blog so keep an eye out for that. long story short, it really would depend where in the season they are IMO, esp as to what workouts you do between peaks. But so many factors in amateur athlete highest performance when most are training 8-10 hours a week, as they aren’t really peaking, they’re just seeing differences in fitness levels. ie, so many go on random stints away from training, cant keep a regular training schedule, etc etc. Much different than the pro athlete or serious cat 1-2.
let me know if that doesn’t make sense; trying to be as succinct as possible without typing a novel.
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It makes sense. I’m that guy who never has really peaked mostly due to work schedule (long blocks completely off then long blocks riding). Just no way to “train” consistently. I’m in an interesting point right now at work and I literally have had every day available to ride since March 1. While I worked up until the third week of March I rode every day except one. Mostly LSD, some SST, some trail riding which turns into low rpm/high power, and then some super easy zone 1 spinners. Still not close to what you do but, a decent amount of work for me (33K Kj’s for March).
I’m noticing some nice things with this consistency is where I’m going with this. Nothing new. It’s literally just base. But, after all these years, I guess I’ve not really had the opportunity to do it to this degree. I won’t be flying at all in April and May looks like no flying again. I plan to keep on keeping on and sort of interested to push it up a little more while I have this once in a life time opportunity. Watching TSB very closely and eating like a horse.
Checking out your youtube page. Thanks for the insight.
It’s my 1st year tracking CTL and other training metrics.
My graph looks like a big long steady ramp.
In your experience how high can CTL go? Is there a limit?
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You ride a lot! I guess it could go as high as you let it, it’s based tss per day in a simple sense. If you ride 300 tss every day it could go that high!
You aren’t resting enough for what it’s worth. Been negative TSB very Long time.
Brendan John Housler
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Are you sure your weight is set correctly and your power meter is working OK? FTP of 400Watts / 6.2W/kg is pro level! Respect anyways for the hard work in the last months. Looks impressive.
Thanks. Yes weight and power meter are set OK. Pro is the target 
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Easier to have a higher CTL as a triathlete. Added TSS of swimming every day, without the impact on your leg muscles/joints, and even running creates a different movement pattern which spreads the load around your body a bit.
I was over 170 last year while training for IM Boulder, and over 130 for almost the entire winter & spring. Basically train until you get cold night sweats, and then take a day off. Super healthy.
Now with almost exclusively cycling I’ve ramped from 65 this January to 130 now. Feeling the effects of being over 120 for about 3 months. Trying to string it along with a couple more solid weeks before tapering and racing end of July.
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Most pro’s take their CTL up to 120-140 not counting stage races athletes. You should avoid going -30 as you burn out or overtrain. You must be young or your FTP is set incorrectly or are a genetic freak to have a 200 ctl.
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You think his FTP is set too low then? (A low FTP will artificially drive CTL high)…Also, I’m not familiar with this software. I’m seeing fitness (CTL) of around 150. Fatigue or ATL is around 200. Am I interpreting this wrong?
Anywho, what caught my eye was the normalized 288W for 200k (6 hours). If solo this to me back up this dude is a badass and 400 FTP would be totally acceptable. JMO
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I think his FTP is definitely in that range based on the 288 for 6 hours. (these are pro tour numbers) The statement was just a list of reasons why CTL could be incorrectly driven up. He is putting down a lot of KJ’s and it looks like with a little bit of intensity in there too. In Matt Fitzgeralds book and what I have heard other coaches say, CTL at 200 will eventually break someone.
Edit here is Phil Gaimon from 2015 as a world tour pro: Phil Gaimon, Professional Cyclist Team Garmin, Interview – FasCat Coaching - CTL was project at 135 after training camp etc.
Another - A Detailed Analysis of Cannondale-Drapac Rider Ryan Mullen’s 2017 Classics Campaign | TrainingPeaks
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According to this article, a CTL of 100-150 is “optimal”. That seems to agree with data from various sources, for example, the male vs. female pro comparison I posted in the pro/elite training thread.
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Not disagreeing with the message just questioning the CTL of @_JG being 200 . I’m seeing for the 21st fitness (CTL) 150, fatigue (ATL) around 209 and form (TSB) -59. While high and not possible for most, 150 in conjunction with all the other data is human. May or may not be advisable either, just commenting that it’s doable if that’s a goal.
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Agreed
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