Its important to remember that for the vast majority of intents and purposes (and the ones suggested here), your FTP is merely an index for adjusting workout power. Whether from a ramp test, AI software, 8 min test, or 20 min test, they are all ways of estimating your maximum aerobic power; some estimations are better than others, but without doing an extended test (maybe 40 mins or more?) you dont really know. Whether or not you can hold that power for an hour is a harshly different question altogether. It takes a looooong time to learn about an hour long effort. Its not just a simple āwell my FTP is XYZ so I should be able to pop off an hour effort at that wattage.ā It is pure misconception. A better question āIs my FTP my hour power or something else entirely?ā
This is not generally agreed upon at all. It is quite false actually
No. Your FTP is a % of maximum aerobic capacity and can move up and down. Its called fractional utilization. Studies going back to the 1970s show FTP as % vo2max is highly trainable. There are TR podcasts explaining this.
I dont think i suggested it is somehow static. Yours is a more precise definition for sure, but the point is that TrainerRoad uses it as an index that is estimated. Whether you can hold that index for an actual hour or 45 mins ends up having little bearing on the index itself. It might as well be color coded for some people given how little relevance it might have for something like 45-60 min max power
Duration of FTP is trainable, just like everybody doesnāt start doing 2 hours of sweet spot. Just like when you get started its likely not possible to hold 65% FTP for 4 hours. Think of that everytime someone tells you FTP is 1 hour power. Its not.
Thats exactly what im saying lol, thanks
well there is more than that, as discussed in this and so many other threads, TR adjusts it to keep you within a PL/WL range. Which is hit or miss on accuracy. Conclusion? Donāt believe TRās AI FTP is your actual FTP. It may or not be. And the next conclusion is that high PL ftp workouts at fixed FTP are not only possible but likely probable once youāve past newbie gains in FTP.
TR Threshold PLās are kind of a meme at this point.
I can totally relate! Workouts with recoveries Ā«coughĀ» āscheduled bailoutsā under a minute between long intervals totally turn me into a karen! But Iām good to go with recoveries down to about 3 minutes. Tells me what I need to work on, but I donāt think that being dumped straight into sub-one-minute territory is the answer for me. It would be nice if intra-workout recoverability was its own progression level.
Spickard+1 is evil unless you have huge anaerobic capacity!
Iāve never gotten into a plan where Iām trying to do 7+ PL threshold workouts every week, along with a 7+ PL Vo2 or anaerobic. How does that feel?
As an example, a Haba every week for 3 weeks, as I got close to a bump in threshold would seem pretty draining.
Agreed. I reckon itād be OK if you were a track sprinter with thighs like tree trunks ā¦ each containing maybe 3 mitochondria 
Glycogen and Creatine storage system 
Iāve found that if everything is working correctly during a plan and I let aiftp and adaptive training do itās thingā¦ My threshold PL is around 4-5
I donāt see why this would change much athlete to athlete? 
If you let AT steer the ship ā¦ yes.
Absolutely.
As someone with a TTer phenotype Haba is infinitely more achievable than Spickard+1 which would be totally impossible for someone like myself with a relatively low FRC.
For me the PL levels should be the other way around.
I noticed this very quickly, you canāt compare steady state threshold againist over under PLs.
If I do something like Haba or even higher around a 8 PL then the Threshold level is totally screwed up if I get served up some over-unders where maybe a PL of 5 would be very hard.
Really they should be independent PLs as one relies on FRC / Wā / Anaerobic Capacity and the other doesnt reallyā¦ totally different animals.
I donāt know if Iāve had multiple weeks combining 7+ threshold and VO2, but the general answer to your q isā¦ awful
I do vividly remember plan builder once scheduling Mary Austin followed by something equally nasty the day after ā¦
Spickard sounds impossible to me 118% of FTP for 2.5 minutesā¦ That is the area I would say I can hold for 5min and just did a 4x 3min VO2 workout where the last two intervals werenāt @118% (ok I went a bit to hard on the first one). But thinking about doing that power for 2.5 min and the having to setle in into Threshold work and going again after 2 or 3 minutesā¦ Haba sounds to me like what I would do on a Koolie moore FTP test if my TTE is good if it is bad it is over after 35 min. But 40-45 minutes in that range is doable I think.
I think the problem is that the reality is that you can only cram so much Threshold work into 60min that the workouts need to get crazy, I would try to find time to extend the workout to 90min and pick one of thoseā¦
Of course thereās more to it, but trying to answer a question and trying to flex a bit with a technical FTP definition can be two different things.
Whether high PL threshold workouts are possible has less to do with ānewbie gainsā than it does ādo you even care about having to do those efforts.ā It doesnāt make you a newbie to target 3-5 min efforts. It is completely irrelevant to many what their actual 45 min power is. That doesnāt mean their TR FTP is irrelevant because TR FTP is not 45-60 min power. Just because finding a technically accurate/valid āFTPā is important for you does not mean it is important for everyone. Thatās not the way ridinā a bike works lol